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Please get off the ****

5,705 Views | 42 Replies | Last: 2 days ago by kyledr04
91AggieLawyer
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12:37a, 5/19/26
AG
If you choose to ignore this post, so be it. But I ask you to at least consider it.

My cousin, one of 18 I have (at least, first cousins) and the closest in age to me among them all, has been dipping since at least jr. high. He's over 60 now and today was diagnosed with Stage 4 Eso****eal cancer after some recent health problems. Judging by some of the symptoms, I don't even want to know what other organs tumors are present in. While I live by faith and prayer, rather than by fear, it is difficult to be optimistic based on what I found out today.

Do I know FOR A FACT that his health problems were caused by his dipping? The lawyer in me says probably not, but the common sense and research I've read lead me to believe, yes I do know. So I urge each one of you that still pack: get off. NOW. I realize it may be a challenge. It may end up being the hardest thing you've ever had to do. But to reduce your chances of getting what my cousin now faces -- a pretty painful existence even if everything goes well and he survives the onslaught of his treatment -- has got to be well worth it.

Same thing if you smoke. Hell, it wouldn't be a bad idea to stop drinking while you're at it. Does poor food habits have the same risk? Maybe -- and if you want to urge better diets and exercise, I won't accuse you of hijacking the thread. We all need to be reminded to live healthier. Just think about those that want you around for longer than you (maybe we) will be around if your lifestyle doesn't change.
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maroon barchetta
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In reply to 91AggieLawyer • 1:30a, 5/19/26
In my time at Mr. Anderson's Fun House, I saw the occasional patient who was battling oral cancer of some form and had lost a significant portion of the lower part of their face.

That hospital is probably the only place they felt ok walking around without some sort of mask or bandana. And even then they got some looks of horror.

The Harvey Dent/Two Face character from the Dark Knight movies is real. And what the OP suggested could help prevent someone on this board from ever stepping into that reality.
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Hoosegow
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7:04a, 5/19/26
My MIL just passed away from esophogeal cancer. She never dipped or smoked a day in her life. She was 82.

No, dipping does not always cause esophogeal cancer. It does, however, increase the risk.

I hate to say this, but Stage 4 is s death sentence. Enjoy the time with him that you have left.
Class of '94
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SGrem
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7:20a, 5/19/26
For my 27th birthday I was diagnosed with stage 4 type B aggressive hodgkins disease. MD Anderson turned me away. Very literally told me to go home and die. Three other oncologists told me the same thing. One of them called me back and said he had something we could try but if it didn't work he would kill me faster than the cancer. It was my only hope to try.

Wife left me and my daughter 2 weeks after diagnosis because she didnt want a cancer husband. My daughter was 9 months old.
11 months of chemo once a week for 8-12hours.
11 weeks of radiation every day.
I am now 51 and in remission for 23 yrs and my daughter is 25 and killing it!!!

Never smoked. Never dipped. Never seen drugs in my life. Hardly any drinking maybe a bottle of whiskey and a 24 pack of beer over a years time. No bad habits. Eat reasonably. Fish and hunt all the time. Purdy clean living. Worked out and exercised couple times a week.

Sometimes it just gets ya....
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1988PA-Aggie
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In reply to SGrem • 7:35a, 5/19/26
SGrem said:
Wife left me and my daughter 2 weeks after diagnosis because she didnt want a cancer husband.

Oh my goodness!? Elaborate if you like on what your reaction or thoughts were, but geez, I've read those last five words of this sentence 10 times.

Props to you though! Your daughter, the cancer fight, cleaner more pure living....YOU the man!
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BlueSmoke
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7:44a, 5/19/26
Max Power
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In reply to SGrem • 8:43a, 5/19/26
AG
SGrem said:
For my 27th birthday I was diagnosed with stage 4 type B aggressive hodgkins disease. MD Anderson turned me away. Very literally told me to go home and die. Three other oncologists told me the same thing. One of them called me back and said he had something we could try but if it didn't work he would kill me faster than the cancer. It was my only hope to try.

Wife left me and my daughter 2 weeks after diagnosis because she didnt want a cancer husband. My daughter was 9 months old.
11 months of chemo once a week for 8-12hours.
11 weeks of radiation.
I am now 51 and in remission for 23 yrs and my daughter is 25 and killing it!!!

Never smoked. Never dipped. Never seen drugs in my life. Hardly any drinking maybe a bottle of whiskey and a 24 pack of beer over a years time. No bad habits. Eat reasonably. Fish and hunt all the time. Purdy clean living. Worked out and exercised couple times a week.

Sometimes it just gets ya....

If you don't have this wallet sir, you should remedy that.
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chjoak
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9:35a, 5/19/26
AG
My dad started smoking at 14. He supposedly quit for a short time while in the Navy and quit atleast 3-4 times when I was a kid. Everytime he has quit he continued to dip. When I was at TAMU he had a stroke that the Drs say came from a combo of smoking & alcohol. That was the last time he smoked but has dipped off & on since. He has been lucky to not end up with cancer yet but does have a mouth full of false teeth from the dip. The only good thing that has come from is bad habits are a good example of what not to do for his kids & grandkids.
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maroon barchetta
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In reply to SGrem • 9:53a, 5/19/26
SGrem said:


Never smoked. Never dipped. Never seen drugs in my life. Hardly any drinking maybe a bottle of whiskey and a 24 pack of beer over a years time. No bad habits. Eat reasonably. Fish and hunt all the time. Purdy clean living. Worked out and exercised couple times a week.

Sometimes it just gets ya....


Very glad you are here to tell the story.

And yes, sometimes it just gets you, not from any lifestyle choices you made.

Glad you are your daughter are doing so well.
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TxAg20
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In reply to SGrem • 9:55a, 5/19/26
AG
SGrem said:


Wife left me and my daughter 2 weeks after diagnosis because she didnt want a cancer husband.


Sounds like you beat 2 cancers simultaneously. Way to go!
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Milwaukees Best Light
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10:07a, 5/19/26
AG
I am old enough to remember when the government made wearing a seatbelt mandatory. During that time, there was always that guy who had a story of some friend or distant relative that was in a wreck and they 'woulda survived, but that dang seatbelt killed them.' All the stories about folks that dipped for a hundred years and didn't get cancer are just the same story in the new day. One quasi anecdote does not beat years of research, science and common sense.

And, dip is just gross. Carrying around a bottle of spit is gross, and a styrofoam cup with a napkin and spit is even grosser cause it stinks.

All that said, I believe in living your own life. If you want what science, research and common sense say will most likely come your way, go for it. Please keep your insurance up to date so you don't end up on my tab more than you have to.
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maroon barchetta
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In reply to Milwaukees Best Light • 10:11a, 5/19/26
And don't go to a "free" hospital so we all have to pay for your bad decisions.
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Hoyt Ag
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10:22a, 5/19/26
AG
I quit dipping a few years ago. Dont really miss it unless I am fishing and even then, I get that shredded beef jerky in a can in the gas station and it works fine. I dont think anyone in our facility smokes (not at the site at least) but most the under 35yo guys use those Alp and Zen pouches like they are skittles. I cannot imagine those are very good for you, but I obviously know little to nothing about them.
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SGrem
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In reply to TxAg20 • 10:31a, 5/19/26
TxAg20 said:
SGrem said:


Wife left me and my daughter 2 weeks after diagnosis because she didnt want a cancer husband.


Sounds like you beat 2 cancers simultaneously. Way to go!


Toss up which one was a bigger life saving victory.
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AgGrad99
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10:39a, 5/19/26
AG

nvm
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zooguy96
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10:41a, 5/19/26
AG
Never smoked or drank. My dad died of a heart attack at 59 - smoked and drank. My grandfather on my mom's side died at 49. Coal miner and smoked and drank. My brother has severe health issues - drinks heavily.

I figure I've got it from both sides - so I decided very early on (under 10 years old) to never do either. Started watching what I ate last year - lost 35-40 pounds. Feel far better.
I know a lot about a little, and a little about a lot.
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GeorgiAg
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11:41a, 5/19/26
AG
Best is to quit. But if you still want to dip, use a Zyn or similar product. Hopefully to help you wane off of it.

It doesn't have the same toxic compounds as tobacco. However, long term studies on the use of nicotine pouches is still being developed. But for now, the risk is much, much lower.
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maroon barchetta
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In reply to GeorgiAg • 11:53a, 5/19/26
That's what they said about vapes and it turned out to be a lie.
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GeorgiAg
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In reply to maroon barchetta • 11:55a, 5/19/26
AG
maroon barchetta said:
That's what they said about vapes and it turned out to be a lie.

vapes are not better than cigs?
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maroon barchetta
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In reply to GeorgiAg • 12:44p, 5/19/26
GeorgiAg said:
maroon barchetta said:
That's what they said about vapes and it turned out to be a lie.

vapes are not better than cigs?


No.

Studies on their effects are still early compared to decades of research on cigarettes, but here is some info I can share.

A family member works for UT Health in the Texas Medical Center. One of her close work colleagues/friends is a lung researcher. When someone dies and "leaves their body to science", so to speak, he gets their lungs.

When a patient gets a lung transplant, he gets their old lungs.

He is shocked by how many young people he has seen get lung transplants and he received their old lungs and they are just shredded inside. Mid-20's to early 30's. Many using vapes or hookah or e-cigs or whatever other type of system they chose (I don't know much about bidis and kretek's so I can comment on those).

These aren't people that have cystic fibrosis or some early onset of lung cancer or mesothelioma. It's due to their own choices.

The "popcorn lung" condition you hear about is real. This researcher is amazed at how much damage was caused in a relatively short amount of time.

Here's the deal from a Layman's perspective: lungs are designed to take in air, pull the oxygen out of that air to feed red blood cells and maybe some other cells, and remove CO2 from your body.

That's it.

Intentionally pulling something besides air into your lungs for recreational purposes is sheer stupidity and ignorance of how biology works.

You could say the same about the mouth in regards to being used for food and drink, not packing tobacco and chemicals into the cheek and gums for recreation.
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GeorgiAg
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In reply to maroon barchetta • 2:35p, 5/19/26
AG
I dipped at A&M. Got a spot on my lip I had to get taken off. Scared me, so I quit dipping. I was at least a Copenhagen can a day guy, so I started smoking just for the nicotine. I hated that so much it eventually made me quit.
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schmellba99
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In reply to maroon barchetta • 3:40p, 5/19/26
AG
Anything and everything can eventually kill you. That's part of life.

Man has been drinking alcohol for 13,000 years. We've been smoking one substance or another for as long or longer.

A lot of factors go into whether one or a hundred things affect you. Some people get lung cancer without ever having taken even a puff of a cigarette. Some folks can smoke their entire lives and not get cancer and die from something completely unrelated - most of the time it's nothing more than a crap shoot.

Life is too short to live in a santized manner IMO. But that's me. I like my whiskey, I enjoy a good smoke out of my tobacco pipe every now and again. Don't even mind a little herb mixed in here and there.

Quote:
If you want any one thing too badly, it's likely to turn out to be a disappointment. The only healthy way to live life is to learn to like all the little everyday things, like a sip of good whiskey in the evening, a soft bed, a glass of buttermilk...

Gus McCrae

I quit dipping 14 years ago. Don't miss it one bit anymore. I've found other vices that are enjoyable though, and most aren't healthy if taken to excess. Like most everything out there - too much of a good thing isn't a good thing.
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maroon barchetta
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In reply to schmellba99 • 3:52p, 5/19/26
And too much of a known bad thing is a bad thing.

Of course there can be a lot of factors. Ignoring the factors that are proven to increase your risks of disease isn't a good plan.
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maroonblood90
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4:27p, 5/19/26
AG
My father passed at 67 due to throat cancer. Heavy smoker / drinker. Both his parents lived into their nineties. His sisters are alive well into their eighties. My Dad's neighbor was also a heavy smoker and when my Dad got sick, the neighbor chalked it up to bad luck ... "not everyone gets cancer". Guess what happened to him? To make the comment that "everything kills you eventually" is just plain silly.
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Hank the Grifter
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In reply to Hoosegow • 6:06p, 5/19/26
Hoosegow said:
My MIL just passed away from esophogeal cancer. She never dipped or smoked a day in her life. She was 82.

No, dipping does not always cause esophogeal cancer. It does, however, increase the risk.

I hate to say this, but Stage 4 is s death sentence. Enjoy the time with him that you have left.

There's still time to edit this.
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maroon barchetta
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In reply to Hank the Grifter • 6:09p, 5/19/26
Yeah. I survived Stage 4 cancer three times. My chances of survival were low but not zero.
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87Flyfisher
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7:21p, 5/19/26
AG
My wife worked as a Surgical Assistant for an Oral & Maxillofacial Surgeon for 14 years. The last couple of years a big part of her job was to make detailed scans of patient's jawbones so that maybe one day after having all of their teeth pulled, radical surgery, chemo and/or radiation they might could have a prosthesis made to replace what was removed.

If you are wanting motivation to stop dipping, smoking. chew and cigars, talk to her about some things she saw.
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schmellba99
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In reply to maroonblood90 • 9:50a, 5/20/26
AG
maroonblood90 said:
My father passed at 67 due to throat cancer. Heavy smoker / drinker. Both his parents lived into their nineties. His sisters are alive well into their eighties. My Dad's neighbor was also a heavy smoker and when my Dad got sick, the neighbor chalked it up to bad luck ... "not everyone gets cancer". Guess what happened to him? To make the comment that "everything kills you eventually" is just plain silly.

Here's the thing though - you distill it down enough and you'll find that anything and everything out there will eventually be a problem.

The good thing is that we get to make choices for ourselves. Me, I can't imagine a life where I'm sitting at the fire at deer camp and spending every second avoiding the smoke it produces because its bad for me. Or not sitting there enjoying a nice pour (or two or three or four) of bourbon or tequila. Or thinking I can't eat that steak or brisket or whatever we are cooking because red meat is bad for you. I personally prefer to enjoy the little pleasures in life and not think that living a sanitized life is somehow better.

My old man died when he was 66 years old of pancreatic cancer. He quit smoking when he was in his late 20's, I barely remember him drinking growing up and even as we got older he'd only have a beer or rum and coke now and again. No major vices at all. I'm almost 50 now. When I think that I could feasibly have less than 20 years regardless of what I do or don't do, it's kind of sobering. And makes me realize that life is damned short and I have enough misery as it is with other things to not allow myself a guilty pleasure.

Anyhoo, just a different perspective.
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maroon barchetta
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In reply to schmellba99 • 10:10a, 5/20/26
We aren't talking about occasional inhalation of smoke from a campfire. Or an occasional drink of alcohol.

And you know that.
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SGrem
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10:26a, 5/20/26
Like i shared above I live purdy clean.

When i was going thru my treatments I asked my oncologist "my friends, my brother, my cousins, my family we all grew up doing the same things.... so what causes this?"

His answer was simple. "Houston to Beaumont....Cancer capital of the world. Then Baton Rouge to New Orleans is second. You can guess from there why just like me."
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BrazosDog02
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10:27a, 5/20/26
AG
Personally, I think genetics has almost everything to do with it. The issue is that we don't know who has the genes to handle it and as such, moderation in everything is the trick. If you still die, well, it is what it is.

My mom died of colon cancer in her late 50's. She ran our farm, slung hay bales, tended animals, AND worked part time….she wasn't a sit still kind of girl. But there were a lot to variables that could have contributed to it. Red meat, lack of regular checkups, or maybe the fact our diet growing up was largely red meat every meal, butter, lard, etc.

The fact of the matter is that there are a lot of things in life our bodies weren't made to handle. Our bodies weren't generated in a lab 50 years ago. They evolved over millions of years. They aren't designed for the absolute crap we shove in them. Liquor, smoking, tobacco, whatever leeches out of the plastic packaging we get food in, pesticides to at are in my once clean spring fed creek that my deer drink….its trash…poison. And our bodies spend their entire lives going 100% trying to rid itself of these things and it can only do that for so long before it gives up.

I'm not saying we need to kill our deer and roast it on a sharp mesquite branch over an open flame, but dialing back a lot of stuff can go a long way.

After my mom passed, my red meat consumption dropped by 90%. I don't need a damn steak or pot roast every day of the week. It's had once or twice every couple of weeks and fish/chicken replaced it. I still eat bacon sandwiches occasionally when my tomatoes are producing. I still drink tequila a couple times every two weeks, I still drink one beer when I'm with buddies, still wash my hands with chlorinated carburetor cleaner when I'm done working on engines….

This is 2026, we know what will kill us, so we just need to keep an eye on those things and be reasonable.

I agree in that if I cut everything I love out of my life so that I could live 5 years long, it wouldn't be worth it.

On the flip side, my dad drinks boxed wine every day, beer in the evening, smokes unfiltered camels, and has since he was a teen and he's now 80. Other than getting drunk and breaking a hip, he has no known issues. My mom did none of that and died anyway.
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SGrem
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10:36a, 5/20/26
Ami Brown..... the Mom on Alaskan Bush People lived in the bush of Alaska most of her life gardening and raising their own protein etc and died of lung cancer at 62.... so there is that.
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Jbob04
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In reply to SGrem • 11:02a, 5/20/26
AG
Looks like she's still alive.
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maroon barchetta
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In reply to BrazosDog02 • 11:15a, 5/20/26
I've had extensive genetic testing to see if I have any known gene mutations that led to my diagnosis and would put my son or brother or other blood relatives at a higher risk.

Nada. Nothing.

I did grow up in a chemical town and work in the petrochemical industry for a long stretch. As did my parents. That's a more likely cause for me.

It's a complex disease with variations even within certain types of tumors. My disease had a gene called the KRAS gene that made it impervious to a chemo called Irinotecan. Other versions of this same tumor without that gene could be treated with that drug, but not mine.

That is but one example of the complex nature.

It's not always just one thing that caused the cancer. But keeping out things we know will raise risk can help you have a better outcome.
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SGrem
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In reply to Jbob04 • 11:16a, 5/20/26
Jbob04 said:
Looks like she's still alive.


Well good stuff. Still she got lung cancer living in the wilds most of her life in the cleanest air on earth with few unnatural impactors...
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