This seems to come up more often now with the endless amounts of road work. Does anybody know how to do this anymore? Had to slam on my brakes today and someone was basically stopped trying to get into the other lane, despite there being a solid 1/4 mile of road to work with until the 2 lanes went down to one. I casually drove the extra 1/4 mile until the lane ended and smoothly squeezed in. No middle fingers were exchanged and no horns honked.
Does anybody know how to zipper merge?
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Last: 19 min ago by Pahdz
I-10E to I-45S through Downtown Houston is a disaster every single time I drive through.
So, to answer your question, NO.
Honorable Mention - I-45N leaving the Causeway before Tiki Island. You can see the merge from 4 lanes down to 3 for over a mile and yet... I still see people who don't know how to merge every time I leave Galveston.
So, to answer your question, NO.
Honorable Mention - I-45N leaving the Causeway before Tiki Island. You can see the merge from 4 lanes down to 3 for over a mile and yet... I still see people who don't know how to merge every time I leave Galveston.
I'd say about 10% of the populace knows that the zipper merge is safer and more efficient. The other 90% think it's unfair, 10% of which do it anyway because they think they're special.
HollywoodBQ said:
I-10E to I-45S through Downtown Houston is a disaster every single time I drive through.
So, to answer your question, NO.
Honorable Mention - I-45N leaving the Causeway before Tiki Island. You can see the merge from 4 lanes down to 3 for over a mile and yet... I still see people who don't know how to merge every time I leave Galveston.
That interchange has the most asssholes cutting over last minute that I've ever seen.
in the US, or in houston, definitely not.
amazingly, in the UK, everyone does it calmly and without road rage.
amazingly, in the UK, everyone does it calmly and without road rage.
10andBOUNCE said:
This seems to come up more often now with the endless amounts of road work. Does anybody know how to do this anymore? Had to slam on my brakes today and someone was basically stopped trying to get into the other lane, despite there being a solid 1/4 mile of road to work with until the 2 lanes went down to one. I casually drove the extra 1/4 mile until the lane ended and smoothly squeezed in. No middle fingers were exchanged and no horns honked.
Being in the business for a long time... some folks can't read signs or fail to see an arrow board ahead. Those people are the reason new signals go on yellow flash for 2 weeks before becoming active.
Signs seem to typical say "Lane ends merge left/right"
That seems to confuse some people. Why can't the sign show a zipper merge?
That seems to confuse some people. Why can't the sign show a zipper merge?
What boggles my mind is that people don't understand that when people are driving next to each other, the driver in the lane that doesn't end has the right of way. There's a 2 lane to 1 lane merge that I go through every day when I leave work. The left lane ends, and I'm always in the right lane. And I consistently get honked at by people in the left lane when I don't hit my brakes to let them in.
Wildmen03 said:
What boggles my mind is that people don't understand that when people are driving next to each other, the driver in the lane that doesn't end has the right of way. There's a 2 lane to 1 lane merge that I go through every day when I leave work. The left lane ends, and I'm always in the right lane. And I consistently get honked at by people in the left lane when I don't hit my brakes to let them in.
And this is why zipper merge doesn't work.
In order for it to work, drivers have to get off the "right of way" horse and be willing to make it work for the overall good of traffic flow. Not "letting them in" screws up the whole system.
HollywoodBQ said:
I-10E to I-45S through Downtown Houston is a disaster every single time I drive through.
Try driving I-10W at 45 now that they are doing construction around there. Each Monday morning people are having to figure out which lanes are closed and which ones will just end as the signage was done by the Special Ed department at the Derek Zoolander Center for Kids Who Can't Read Good and Wanna Learn to Do Other Stuff Good Too.
Forward said:Wildmen03 said:
What boggles my mind is that people don't understand that when people are driving next to each other, the driver in the lane that doesn't end has the right of way. There's a 2 lane to 1 lane merge that I go through every day when I leave work. The left lane ends, and I'm always in the right lane. And I consistently get honked at by people in the left lane when I don't hit my brakes to let them in.
And this is why zipper merge doesn't work.
In order for it to work, drivers have to get off the "right of way" horse and be willing to make it work for the overall good of traffic flow. Not "letting them in" screws up the whole system.
I agree with this. If the mentality is every man for himself it it won't work as intended, but if there is some kind of understanding that this process helps move traffic for everyone, it works quite well.
Forward said:Wildmen03 said:
What boggles my mind is that people don't understand that when people are driving next to each other, the driver in the lane that doesn't end has the right of way. There's a 2 lane to 1 lane merge that I go through every day when I leave work. The left lane ends, and I'm always in the right lane. And I consistently get honked at by people in the left lane when I don't hit my brakes to let them in.
And this is why zipper merge doesn't work.
In order for it to work, drivers have to get off the "right of way" horse and be willing to make it work for the overall good of traffic flow. Not "letting them in" screws up the whole system.
It works fine. If the people in the lane that ends pay attention and adjust their speed to merge properly, it works. If I'm in the lane that doesn't end and I have to hit my brakes to keep the person next to me to keep from hitting me, how does that help the flow of traffic behind me?
If the person next to me is ahead of me, I let them in. I'm talking about if two cars are right next to each other, the person that has their lane ending has to yield right of way.
Forward said:Wildmen03 said:
What boggles my mind is that people don't understand that when people are driving next to each other, the driver in the lane that doesn't end has the right of way. There's a 2 lane to 1 lane merge that I go through every day when I leave work. The left lane ends, and I'm always in the right lane. And I consistently get honked at by people in the left lane when I don't hit my brakes to let them in.
And this is why zipper merge doesn't work.
In order for it to work, drivers have to get off the "right of way" horse and be willing to make it work for the overall good of traffic flow. Not "letting them in" screws up the whole system.
Bingo. Reach the merge point and every car on the right lets in one car in from the left. Bingo. Everyone keeps moving. Common sense not so common anymore.
Sweet Kitten Feet said:Forward said:Wildmen03 said:
What boggles my mind is that people don't understand that when people are driving next to each other, the driver in the lane that doesn't end has the right of way. There's a 2 lane to 1 lane merge that I go through every day when I leave work. The left lane ends, and I'm always in the right lane. And I consistently get honked at by people in the left lane when I don't hit my brakes to let them in.
And this is why zipper merge doesn't work.
In order for it to work, drivers have to get off the "right of way" horse and be willing to make it work for the overall good of traffic flow. Not "letting them in" screws up the whole system.
Bingo. Reach the merge point and every car on the right lets in one car in from the left. Bingo. Everyone keeps moving. Common sense not so common anymore.
That works if it's stop and go traffic. My example was meaning traveling at speed.
That's fair. If feasible, I try to adjust my speed when I notice that situation developing so that as the merge point approaches, there's enough room for the merge - either in front or behind. Create space, avoid braking. Obviously it doesn't always work out cleanly and sometimes the merging vehicles screw it up.
I don't merge in until the actual end of the merge unless there is some kind of wide open gap. Either way, the merge should Happen at the end and i do think that both lanes should make minor adjustments to accommodate that. Ive had little issue with this in Houston and san antonio. Some folks get pissed and honk but they can just be pissed off. Never understood the "I don't want to let that guy in because the sign showed a merge 1 mile ago" but intelligence isn't the hallmark of most drivers in either of those cities. You don't have trouble like that in the small town I'm in. It's a big city thing.
Problems:
Paranoid people or hyper courteous people get in the through lane early and back it up more.
More paranoid persons in the ending lane suddenly feel like they have to stop and get over way before the merge point so they don't get trapped in a pressure situation and create a worse traffic backup by trying to merge too early.
Some people fly up to the Marge point if the ending lane opens up at reckless speed and try to nose in behind the merger in front of them instead of zipper.
Zipper works fine with very slow traffic or faster traffic with adequate signage and reasonable vehicle spacing. It is a mess at moderate speed and tighter spacing because it intimidates inexperienced or poor drivers.
I only get upset when some ahole brraks a smoothly operating zipper by obnoxiously tailgating the guy in front, or an ass that runs the shoulder to create to the merge.
On a related note, I just about wanted to go road rage on a selfish ******* that missed his chance to get over into a left turn only lane in front of me, and decided he would make the go straight lane at a major highway intersection his own personal turn lane. The left turn lane had a red already and was backed up, but the through lights were green, yet this ass flips on his blinker and just stops at the intersection and nearly causes a massive pileup behind him. Stayed there through the entire light cycle, and when the left turn lane light went green, he jumps out and cut off the first car starting to make a left as there is only one lane to turn into. Complete *******. Deserves to have his engine explode in his Chevy.
Paranoid people or hyper courteous people get in the through lane early and back it up more.
More paranoid persons in the ending lane suddenly feel like they have to stop and get over way before the merge point so they don't get trapped in a pressure situation and create a worse traffic backup by trying to merge too early.
Some people fly up to the Marge point if the ending lane opens up at reckless speed and try to nose in behind the merger in front of them instead of zipper.
Zipper works fine with very slow traffic or faster traffic with adequate signage and reasonable vehicle spacing. It is a mess at moderate speed and tighter spacing because it intimidates inexperienced or poor drivers.
I only get upset when some ahole brraks a smoothly operating zipper by obnoxiously tailgating the guy in front, or an ass that runs the shoulder to create to the merge.
On a related note, I just about wanted to go road rage on a selfish ******* that missed his chance to get over into a left turn only lane in front of me, and decided he would make the go straight lane at a major highway intersection his own personal turn lane. The left turn lane had a red already and was backed up, but the through lights were green, yet this ass flips on his blinker and just stops at the intersection and nearly causes a massive pileup behind him. Stayed there through the entire light cycle, and when the left turn lane light went green, he jumps out and cut off the first car starting to make a left as there is only one lane to turn into. Complete *******. Deserves to have his engine explode in his Chevy.
Quote:
Some people fly up to the Marge point if the ending lane opens up at reckless speed and try to nose in behind the merger in front of them instead of zipper.
This is what pisses me off, especially when I'm in an already merged line at a minimum safe following distance from the vehicle in front of me and some asswipe comes flying from the back of the pack and squeezes in. Then I have to brake to regain a safe following distance causing a ripple effect to the cars behind me. To add icing to cake, often they'll drive slow once traffic clears out ahead and hold up the entire pack.
Anymore?
It's a new thing, we old farts never heard of it
However, I am 100% in favor of using it. But it needs to be publicized, and the road construction crews need to post signs to zipper merge.
It's a new thing, we old farts never heard of it
However, I am 100% in favor of using it. But it needs to be publicized, and the road construction crews need to post signs to zipper merge.
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All of this "greater good" and "if people would just act logically" talk makes me think none of y'all have ever driven in Houston, where every road is like the chariot race in Ben Hur. There are only two merge strategies that work in Houston. At slow speeds it's "my car is bigger and crappier than yours and I'm coming over" and at high speeds you get in position next to a gap and turn on your blinker, this signals to the car in the next lane over that you would like them to speed up and create a larger gap behind them, into which you can safely merge.
Agreed there need to be signs. Not that people read signs, but people think they're being proper and courteous by merging hundreds of yards early and those zipper merging are jerks.
I've had good luck in Houston with the old "lean over and fiddle with the radio and make it look like you're not paying attention as you drift over" maneuver. People only get ballsy with you and block you because they know you are watching your mirrors and won't probably hit them. If they think you truly aren't paying attention, they won't risk their vehicles getting hit. They'll move.
10andBOUNCE said:
This seems to come up more often now with the endless amounts of road work. Does anybody know how to do this anymore? Had to slam on my brakes today and someone was basically stopped trying to get into the other lane, despite there being a solid 1/4 mile of road to work with until the 2 lanes went down to one. I casually drove the extra 1/4 mile until the lane ended and smoothly squeezed in. No middle fingers were exchanged and no horns honked.
I deal with this all the time by my house where a freeway has a closed lane. The lane that doesn't merge will have cars backed up half a mile while the merging lane sits practically empty. Sometimes people will purposefully block the merging lane so you can't merge at the merge point, causing further backups. Insanity. Any time I merge at the merge point, I am able to do so at the speed with which the traffic is flowing, without causing anyone to have to stop on the freeway. It is insane to me how so few people realize that everything would simply flow smoother and faster if they all just merged at the merge point in zipper fashion. I'm certain my wife is tired of me talking about this every time we are on that stretch of road lmao.
To answer your question - No. I agree with Martin. those that merge early or wait in the long line are upset at those that use the full lanes.
I merge when there is an opening or at the merge point. I don't want to be viewed as the jerk but I'm not stopping in the middle of a perfectly good lane. I've driven a lot in Oklahoma and I swear they all just stop immediately where they are soon as they see a merge coming which just butchers everything.
I don't recall where, but I have seen both temporary and permanent merges that have a sign that says "use both lanes to merge point". I think these signs would help a lot vs the generic "lanes merge" or "lane ends merge X"
I merge when there is an opening or at the merge point. I don't want to be viewed as the jerk but I'm not stopping in the middle of a perfectly good lane. I've driven a lot in Oklahoma and I swear they all just stop immediately where they are soon as they see a merge coming which just butchers everything.
I don't recall where, but I have seen both temporary and permanent merges that have a sign that says "use both lanes to merge point". I think these signs would help a lot vs the generic "lanes merge" or "lane ends merge X"
My favorite is the entitled, clueless a'hole that sees traffic come up the other lane to zipper merge and decides he is going to drive right down the middle of the two lanes so no one can get by them. Worse than the dolts who drive with their hazards on if it starts to rain….even lightly.
For sure in Oklahoma. There are signs and I think it might be a dumbass state law that says "merge now" like a mile before the construction zone or whatever. It's asinine.FightinTAC08 said:
To answer your question - No. I agree with Martin. those that merge early or wait in the long line are upset at those that use the full lanes.
I merge when there is an opening or at the merge point. I don't want to be viewed as the jerk but I'm not stopping in the middle of a perfectly good lane. I've driven a lot in Oklahoma and I swear they all just stop immediately where they are soon as they see a merge coming which just butchers everything.
I don't recall where, but I have seen both temporary and permanent merges that have a sign that says "use both lanes to merge point". I think these signs would help a lot vs the generic "lanes merge" or "lane ends merge X"
GAC06 said:
Agreed there need to be signs. Not that people read signs, but people think they're being proper and courteous by merging hundreds of yards early and those zipper merging are jerks.
There isn't a sign that will make it work better. The lane closed ahead should imply that.
Sweet Kitten Feet said:Forward said:Wildmen03 said:
What boggles my mind is that people don't understand that when people are driving next to each other, the driver in the lane that doesn't end has the right of way. There's a 2 lane to 1 lane merge that I go through every day when I leave work. The left lane ends, and I'm always in the right lane. And I consistently get honked at by people in the left lane when I don't hit my brakes to let them in.
And this is why zipper merge doesn't work.
In order for it to work, drivers have to get off the "right of way" horse and be willing to make it work for the overall good of traffic flow. Not "letting them in" screws up the whole system.
Bingo. Reach the merge point and every car on the right lets in one car in from the left. Bingo. Everyone keeps moving. Common sense not so common anymore.
That's great right up to the point where everyone has merged and the one Jack ass think they can run right up to the end and cut in. You have had a 1/4 mile to merge like everyone else but think you are entitled to run up to the end and gain on everyone who has already worked together to merge to keep traffic moving. You as it can sit your ass up there and honk all you want. If that makes me the problem for not letting you in then so be it.
Gil '91
Don't get mad at other people utilizing the usable road just because you're ******ed and sit in the lane of traffic.
Yep, stupid law they passed in Oklahoma in the name of worker safety.
GAC06 said:
Agreed there need to be signs. Not that people read signs, but people think they're being proper and courteous by merging hundreds of yards early and those zipper merging are jerks.
Zipper merge is definitely a thing in Minnesota and highly encouraged. During construction season there is tons of messaging on electric signage about zipper merging, and MNDOT has social media campaigns about the benefits of the zipper.
"If done correctly" on zipper merges is just like "if done correctly" on socialism. It will never, ever work because of human nature. People are self-interested, people are dumb, people suck at doing stuff. There are folks determined that they are going to figure out how to make people do this properly, but it's never going to happen
So... just disregard and keep doing stupid *****
Talking zipper merge, socialism you're right
Talking zipper merge, socialism you're right
Texags is the only place I've ever seen/heard the term zipper merge. Definitely didn't teach us that in drivers Ed.
DannyDuberstein said:
"If done correctly" on zipper merges is just like "if done correctly" on socialism. It will never, ever work because of human nature. People are self-interested, people are dumb, people suck at doing stuff. There are folks determined that they are going to figure out how to make people do this properly, but it's never going to happen
as i said above, it works plenty well elsewhere. our entitled dumbasses like the fella above are the ones who have a problem doing it.
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