Farmer1906 said:

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The 2025 season still matters. You have to try and resolve it internally. We're not going to make a run without success starting pitching. We need to squeeze every last drop out of Framber this month and next, then move on.

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Framber has been in meltdown mode for over a month. How much leash do you give him with just a few weeks to go?

Dusty now having been vindicated about

- Diaz
- McCormick
- Maldonado's importance to keeping our "ace" on a simple game plan and away from torching his relationship with every teammate he can

is the wildest turn of events.

The Sun said:

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Farmer1906 said:

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The 2025 season still matters. You have to try and resolve it internally. We're not going to make a run without success starting pitching. We need to squeeze every last drop out of Framber this month and next, then move on.

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Framber has been in meltdown mode for over a month. How much leash do you give him with just a few weeks to go?

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Just my personal opinion, but I think we've already watched Framber's last quality start as an Astro. Happy to be wrong, but knowing his mental fragility, I don't see how he recovers this season.

Based on Dana's comments today, they're still gonna trot him out there, but his mental game has been deteriorating for two months now. Not a great way to convince clubs to sign you to a mega deal.

I'm grateful for his part in the glorious 2022 run, but it's time for everyone to move on.

Would be curious to hear if texasaggie2015 has any inside scoop on all of this

BigPete3281 said:

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This guy has got Orioles written all over him.

He will be our new #1 and we will give him at least $150 million.

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If Framber has mental meltdowns while pitching in Houston can you imagine if he was signed by the Yankees? He would never survive with their fan base.

Sources tell me tensions rose in the Astros clubhouse last night, after the loss, when players confronted Framber Valdez for his in game actions involving César Salazar.

The argument escalated and coaches eventually stepped in to calm the situation.

While intent behind the…

— Michael Schwab (@michaelschwab13) September 3, 2025

Beau Holder said:

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Dusty now having been vindicated about

- Diaz
- McCormick
- Maldonado's importance to keeping our "ace" on a simple game plan and away from torching his relationship with every teammate he can

is the wildest turn of events.

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I guarantee you Framber is not nailing Maldy with a fastball like that, nor is he deciding to throw his own pitch. Framber needs a more veteran catcher who can whip his ass to be successful.

At least Yainer's bat makes up for not having that (he has a 90 wRC+)

EastCoastAgNc said:

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Beau Holder said:

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Dusty now having been vindicated about

- Diaz
- McCormick
- Maldonado's importance to keeping our "ace" on a simple game plan and away from torching his relationship with every teammate he can

is the wildest turn of events.

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I guarantee you Framber is not nailing Maldy with a fastball like that, nor is he deciding to throw his own pitch. Framber needs a more veteran catcher who can whip his ass to be successful.

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Framber needs to go pout like a 12 year old somewhere else. We should have traded him at the deadline for a haul of prospects. Hindsight is 20/20, but given what we see today, it would have been the right move.

So that's the thing that Framber isn't processing correctly.

Everyone knows it was intentional because if it wasn't then 2 things happen.

A) You show remorse and pat you chest and tell him My bad you good?

B) You call a timeout and get on the same page and figure it out to get right again.

Neither of those things happened. That's why no one is dumb enough to believe it was just a typical cross up.

MaxPower said:

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Sources tell me tensions rose in the Astros clubhouse last night, after the loss, when players confronted Framber Valdez for his in game actions involving César Salazar.

The argument escalated and coaches eventually stepped in to calm the situation.

While intent behind the…

— Michael Schwab (@michaelschwab13) September 3, 2025

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But weren't we told that it was just a misunderstanding/miscommunication?
At least the players have Salazar's back.

Absolute trashy behavior by Framber. Head case.

HB, Javier, Alexander, Arraghetti and Garcia looks like a decent five man rotation without Framber. Sit his ass down.

MaxPower said:

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Sources tell me tensions rose in the Astros clubhouse last night, after the loss, when players confronted Framber Valdez for his in game actions involving César Salazar.

The argument escalated and coaches eventually stepped in to calm the situation.

While intent behind the…

— Michael Schwab (@michaelschwab13) September 3, 2025

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Yeah - it got ugly from what I'm told.

This is my opinion only: You can put all-star level players at every position and they won't necessarily win all by themselves. They may win some but they won't win them all.

SOMEBODY has to steer the ship. Without a qualified person at the helm, every ship will eventually run aground. It is the Captain (in this case, the Manager) that keeps the ship going where it is intended to go.

I'm sorry if I've hurt anyone's feelings, but I just don't see Joe as having the qualities to be the Captain. He's evidently a good second-in-charge but that doesn't necessarily qualify him be be the Captain.

Is this where the Peter Principle is applied?

Assuming Framber has another start, the piece de resistance for the season would be the Astros bench clearing and whooping his ass if he melts down again.

mwm said:

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This is my opinion only: You can put all-star level players at every position and they won't necessarily win all by themselves. They may win some but they won't win them all.

SOMEBODY has to steer the ship. Without a qualified person at the helm, every ship will eventually run aground. It is the Captain (in this case, the Manager) that keeps the ship going where it is intended to go.

I'm sorry if I've hurt anyone's feelings, but I just don't see Joe as having the qualities to be the Captain. He's evidently a good second-in-charge but that doesn't necessarily qualify him be be the Captain.

Is this where the Peter Principle is applied?

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Joe has kept this team in first place with bubble gum and bailing wire. The injury situation has been a giant **** sandwich and everyone has to take a bite.

texasaggie2015 said:

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MaxPower said:

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Sources tell me tensions rose in the Astros clubhouse last night, after the loss, when players confronted Framber Valdez for his in game actions involving César Salazar.

The argument escalated and coaches eventually stepped in to calm the situation.

While intent behind the…

— Michael Schwab (@michaelschwab13) September 3, 2025

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Yeah - it got ugly from what I'm told.

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Good.

Joe needs to stop being everyone's friend and be their manager. Grow some balls and go dusty baker on them. Never thought I would say this but miss that about Dusty

Next two games are huge. Would love to at least split and then win 2/3 in Arlington.

6 remaining against the Rangers and 3 against Seattle. Really need to go 6-3 in those games

The Sun said:

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mwm said:

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This is my opinion only: You can put all-star level players at every position and they won't necessarily win all by themselves. They may win some but they won't win them all.

SOMEBODY has to steer the ship. Without a qualified person at the helm, every ship will eventually run aground. It is the Captain (in this case, the Manager) that keeps the ship going where it is intended to go.

I'm sorry if I've hurt anyone's feelings, but I just don't see Joe as having the qualities to be the Captain. He's evidently a good second-in-charge but that doesn't necessarily qualify him be be the Captain.

Is this where the Peter Principle is applied?

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Joe has kept this team in first place with bubble gum and baling wire. The injury situation has been a giant **** sandwich and everyone has to take a bite.

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He also steered them back from a 12-24 start last year to win the (albeit awful) division.

I am fine with saying the jury's still out on him but when you consider the results of the last two years in context, I don't think you can just flat out say he can't lead.

That said I think something extra needs to be applied here if the same players are doing the same garbage every game and they keep failing to score.

tjack16 said:

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Next two games are huge. Would love to at least split and then win 2/3 in Arlington.

6 remaining against the Rangers and 3 against Seattle. Really need to go 6-3 in those games

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I bet 6-3 in those games knocks us to 2nd place.

Jose Altuve accuses Yankees of cheating after blowout loss:

"Those guys were wearing buzzers." pic.twitter.com/BPBqfZaP8m

— (Parody) FAX Sports: MLB (@MLBONFAX) September 3, 2025

The Sun said:

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tjack16 said:

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Next two games are huge. Would love to at least split and then win 2/3 in Arlington.

6 remaining against the Rangers and 3 against Seattle. Really need to go 6-3 in those games

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I bet 6-3 in those games knocks us to 2nd place.

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4-2 against the rangers, 2-1 against Seattle and playing .500 ball the other 14 games wouldn't (89-73). Unless one of them goes on a heater

BCEDAg said:

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HB, Javier, Alexander, Arraghetti and Garcia looks like a decent five man rotation without Framber. Sit his ass down.

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I lean this direction as well. Let last night be the final memory that teams have of Framber, and see what kind of contract he gets as a result.

He's an elite talent, but he has been an absolute liability as of late. And sending that kind of message makes it abundantly clear to the rest of the guys in the locker room that nobody is above the team, and you're either part of this group or you can GTFO. Who knows, that could be the spark that is desperately needed to rally this team back together.

Maybe this is just me being hyper emotional and irrational while it is still very fresh. But if it were announced today that Framber is being shut down for the rest of the season I would sleep just fine tonight

As it should have

I agree. Whether that is replacing hitting coaches or reevaluating whatever the analytics team is feeding these guys, it needs corrective action. I suspect it is a combination of both.

tjack16 said:

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The Sun said:

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tjack16 said:

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Next two games are huge. Would love to at least split and then win 2/3 in Arlington.

6 remaining against the Rangers and 3 against Seattle. Really need to go 6-3 in those games

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I bet 6-3 in those games knocks us to 2nd place.

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4-2 against the rangers, 2-1 against Seattle and playing .500 ball the other 14 games wouldn't (89-73). Unless one of them goes on a heater

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The Rangers are in the midst of a heater right now.

I'd skip his next turn in the rotation personally. He's been so bad recently that throwing him off his routine can't make it much worse.

Especially given his next start would be on the road at Toronto

Roster tweaks or philosophical changes to lineup construction, too. You can't succeed with a Yainer Diaz and a Mauricio Dubon and a slumping Jose Altuve in the same lineup day after day. Clearly.

So on top of Framber's poor performance down the stretch he manages to create a major clubhouse distraction in the midst of a pennant chase.

The Sun said:

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tjack16 said:

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The Sun said:

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tjack16 said:

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Next two games are huge. Would love to at least split and then win 2/3 in Arlington.

6 remaining against the Rangers and 3 against Seattle. Really need to go 6-3 in those games

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I bet 6-3 in those games knocks us to 2nd place.

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4-2 against the rangers, 2-1 against Seattle and playing .500 ball the other 14 games wouldn't (89-73). Unless one of them goes on a heater

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The Rangers are in the midst of a heater right now.

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Against trash cans. They're 29-44 against >.500 teams which is mostly what they're about to start playing.

He's had a hard year putting together lineups, etc. No doubt. I'm not suggesting that he has had an ideal, carefree year.

But there are apparently some flaws in the way he's handled the clubhouse. I think there was a big flaw exposed last night - and this one happened in the home stretch of a tight pennant race.

Beau Holder said:

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The Sun said:

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tjack16 said:

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The Sun said:

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tjack16 said:

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Next two games are huge. Would love to at least split and then win 2/3 in Arlington.

6 remaining against the Rangers and 3 against Seattle. Really need to go 6-3 in those games

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I bet 6-3 in those games knocks us to 2nd place.

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4-2 against the rangers, 2-1 against Seattle and playing .500 ball the other 14 games wouldn't (89-73). Unless one of them goes on a heater

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The Rangers are in the midst of a heater right now.

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Against trash cans. They're 29-44 against >.500 teams which is mostly what they're about to start playing.

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How are we doing against trash cans? I honestly can't find the stat anywhere.

Framber's next start will be in Toronto vs. the 1st place Blue Jays