Show seemed to go as many do - story wasn't written for this many seasons so it had to be expanded on the fly and the writers simply weren't good enough to keep a cohesive story. The entire Vecna storyline the last few seasons has been a complete mess.

Final episodes had some good moments, but most of them revolved around flashbacks to the earlier seasons.

So you've got some great actors (Max, Steve, Dustin) throwing out lines that are just extremely hollow or nonsense.

And then you've got some bad actors with way too much dialogue... It was a tough spot because these were good/great child actors but have not made the jump to being competent adult actors. Noah Schnapp (Will) and Millie Bobby Brown (Eleven) are simply bad actors at this age. All their deliveries seem cringe, forced and disjointed.

Charlie Conway said:

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It's pretty clear the Duffers are idea guys, not execution guys. They have all these easter eggs, cool ideas, etc. but they have no idea how to thread them through the overall story.

Look at Vince Gilligan, I know he has put out some of the highest rated tv of all time, but his details and little beats flow through and connect all throughout the storyline. Every little detail is meticulous and thought through. That's why it's so satisfying at the conclusion.

Now, paired against Stranger Things. There's ground work for all these cool ideas and easter eggs in the show, but they don't amount to anything. This has left a lot of the audience unsatisfied because all the ideas that have laid into the show haven't concluded into anything.

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If you don't know exactly how it's going to end before you start, you aren't going to have a good ending.

They might have had a general idea how they wanted multiple season to progress, but its clear that Vecna was never the original big bad, they never intended on 5 seasons, and simply had no idea how hard it would be to bring everything together.

I thought season 4 was awesome. You can tell that retconned Vecna in as the big bad, but it still worked. The tone, feel, drama, emotion, horror.. it was all there. It worked. All they had to do was keep season 5 very similar while bringing it all home. No new storylines. No new characters. No new relationships. Just wrap up what is already out there.

Instead, we had to explore Will's bedroom sexual preferences, go deeper on Robin's sexual preferences, spend way too much time on character relationships nobody cared about, had to bring in the science teacher and give him something random to do, had to give more for Lucas' sister to do, had to bring a new big bad government lady to largely do nothing. Meanwhile, multiple characters were nothing but convenient plot pieces for a brief moment, only to be completely ignored and never addressed again.

This all stems from never having a true outline with a clear finishing point.

I actually think part of the problem is that we don't do shows with 20 episodes anymore. There is no time for meaningful character development because you can't have a fun monster of the week filler episode where you learn more about robin and vickie and or will without it feeling like you are *stealing time* for more important stuff. If something doesn't "happen" every episode, viewers feel like it was a waste of time, even if its good character development.

I enjoyed it overall. Not perfect of course but as a gen x D&D nerd it hit the right chords. Even the monster manual closing credits were great.

No, dahmer does not make an appearance. His hunting grounds were in Milwaukee, anyway.

Steve was good in Free Guy a few years ago playing a nerd.

1 said:

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Anyone buy into the rumor that there's a surprise episode dropping on Jan 7?

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Zero % imo

NukeAg10 said:

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No, dahmer does not make an appearance. His hunting grounds were in Milwaukee, anyway.

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fig96 said:

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Ghost of Andrew Eaton said:

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Ryan the Temp said:

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RightWingConspirator said:

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a time period where these things would be considered taboo.

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Which is exactly the point of the show runners. It demonstrates how the process of coming out carried substantially more weight during that period of time than it would today. That was also why Will's secret was a big thing for Vecna to latch onto.

That being said, I didn't really like the way they did it, but the meaning behind it stands.

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Had we seen Vecna use other people's fears against them? I can't recall but could be wrong.

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Very directly against Hop in the finale.

I feel like he also did some with El related to her family and friends in other eps but can't recall specifically.

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The cheerleader had an eating disorder because of her horrible mother, and that was Vecna's haunt. That one kid saw a car accident and didn't save the people, and that's what Vecna showed him. Max was full of guilt about Billy dying, and that was her haunt.

If you think about Will throughout the show, he was actually pretty brave. The only time he really melted down was when his friends were getting into girls, and he was getting left out. Then, right before the speech, Will tells his mother this (per scrapsfromtheloft.com's script):

Quote:

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[Will] Mom? Um… Earlier today when you asked me what happened in Vecna's mind, I didn't tell you everything. When Vecna attacks, he weakens you by turning your own mind against you, by bringing out everything inside you that hurts. So I fought back by focusing on happy memories, memories from when I was a kid, and when I wasn't scared, and when I felt most happy. That's how I took control in the MACZ and how I killed those Demos. And I thought the same would work on Vecna too. But he found a way past. And he showed me things, Mom. He showed me the most awful things.

[Joyce] No, listen. Whatever he showed you, it's not real. He plays tricks. He lies.

[Will] No, he doesn't. What he showed me… it didn't come from him. It came from me. He sees everything, Mom. He sees my thoughts. He sees my memories. And he sees my secrets. But Max, she told me he's also afraid, which proves I can beat him. But for me to do that, you need to know… I think you need to know the truth.

[door opens]

[Mike] Oh. Uh… Sorry. We just heard from Hop. He's 15 minutes out. So we should probably leave in five. Is everything okay?

[Joyce] Yeah, we'll be out in a minute.

[Will] Wait. I think you need to hear this too. Everyone does.

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Then the speech happens, and in it, he says this:

Quote:

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And I thought I was finally okay with myself, but… but then today… Today Vecna showed me what would happen if I did this, if I told you guys the truth. He showed me a future, and in this future, some of you are just… are just worried for me. Worried that things will be harder for me. And it just makes me feel like something's wrong with me. So I… So I push you away. And for the rest of us, we just drift apart more and more and more and more and more until I'm alone. And I know none of that has happened, and Vecna can't see into the future. But he can see into our minds, and he knows things. And it just felt so real. It felt so real.

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So if there's a complaint to be had, it's that this little bit of exposition right before the reveal felt convenient because we hadn't actually seen Vecna attack Will with his fears the way we saw him attack Max or the cheerleader. That being said, I feel certain that if there had been a scene with Vecna attacking Will about being alone and ostracized by his friends and family for being gay, there'd be people pissed off that it was included.

Anyway, I personally thought they handled it well, that it was significant to the story, and that they told Will's story of coming out to his friends and family in a way that probably felt very familiar to some folks watching. And I thought the actor did a good job carrying that scene.

this conformity gate theory is INSANEEE, if it doesn’t happen we truly are better writers than the duffers #conformitygate #StrangerThings5 pic.twitter.com/xskLExHXIe

— Adnan (@AdnanLovesCats) January 4, 2026

My 18 year old is a full on Conformity Gate conspiracy theorist. I highly doubt it but would be cool