fc2112 said:

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Say what you will, but it's kinda funny to see people move out to an area where they have to use toll roads and then complain about the fact they have to use toll roads.

I live in Arlington, work in Fort Worth, and rarely drive a toll road unless I just want to get somewhere faster.

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It's kinda easy to not take tolls when you have a lot of options at your disposal, which you do going from Alrington to Ft. Worth.

Don't worry. They'll build it with a lane quantity not adequate for the volume of traffic, so they can add more lanes 10 years from now. They'll also not provide adequate drainage on the surface, so they can correct it 5 years from now. This way they have you on the hook for tolls in perpetuity.

Good news is they reduced headcount by eliminating toll booth workers, so the toll rates would go down by eliminating base cost...sigh.

Honestly, I'd be ok paying for tolls if the state eliminated property taxes. I don't own the roads, but I should at least outright own my property.

AlaskanAg99 said:

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Now for some fun facts, HCTRA has a "surplus" annually after M&O and CIP is taken into account. Local commissioners can only spend these funds on "mobilitiy" projects and that becomes a gray area. So a lot of sidewalks are being built that tie into the toll roads. It's a real stretch. Now the fun part is at the State, there's a bill in consideration that the City of Houston wants a chunk of the surplus where it will go into their general fund. Theres a lot of debate at commissioners court and animosity between the entire court and Whitmeyer.

The real question is if they're running a 300M surplus, they're overcharging on the tolls themselves. If the state passes the law I wouldn't be surprised if court lowers toll rates just to stick it to Houston.

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F that noise. HCTRA now runs the tolls in and around Austin. So the City of Houston wants money from around the state to go into their general fund? That's nothing but a money grab.

schmellba99 said:

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fc2112 said:

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Say what you will, but it's kinda funny to see people move out to an area where they have to use toll roads and then complain about the fact they have to use toll roads.

I live in Arlington, work in Fort Worth, and rarely drive a toll road unless I just want to get somewhere faster.

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It's kinda easy to not take tolls when you have a lot of options at your disposal, which you do going from Alrington to Ft. Worth.

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Point being - I moved somewhere and chose to work somewhere such that there were already existing roads.

If you move halfway to Oklahoma to get away from "undesirables", don't act surprised that toll roads are required to get you into town,

fc2112 said:

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schmellba99 said:

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fc2112 said:

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Say what you will, but it's kinda funny to see people move out to an area where they have to use toll roads and then complain about the fact they have to use toll roads.

I live in Arlington, work in Fort Worth, and rarely drive a toll road unless I just want to get somewhere faster.

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It's kinda easy to not take tolls when you have a lot of options at your disposal, which you do going from Alrington to Ft. Worth.

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Point being - I moved somewhere and chose to work somewhere such that there were already existing roads.

If you move halfway to Oklahoma to get away from "undesirables", don't act surprised that toll roads are required to get you into town,

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Who is acting surprised for this specific reason?

Those on this thread complaining about toll roads being their only way to get into town.

schmellba99 said:

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cecil77 said:

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Toll roads are not scams. Indeed, user fees are normally the best way for government to provide any service. Why should people that don't use a service have to pay for it?

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OOOOHHHHHH!!!!!!!

Can we apply that to the rest of our taxes?

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We could only wish.

But when user fees are an option, as a good libertarian I've got to favor them.

HTownAg98 said:

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I meant that they are eliminating the continuous center turn lanes.

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Ahh. They need to leave them alone, they are far better than the crap they replaced them with.

fc2112 said:

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Those on this thread complaining about toll roads being their only way to get into town.

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Where on this thread is that the case?

Far as I can tell, you are the only one that thinks that is any part of the discussion.

CDUB98 said:

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Quote:

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I think there are a scam

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Every toll road is a scam.

hth

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TexAgsSean said:

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Teslag said:

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CDUB98 said:

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Quote:

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I think there are a scam

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Every toll road is a scam.

hth

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I see this said a lot but why? I like them. You can pay to bypass the riff raff and get somewhere faster.

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Doesn't our tax money already go to build the roads? So we are having to pay a fee for driving on a road that we already paid for?

I've never looked into that before, so I could very well be wrong.

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JBAG064 said:

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Aren't the taxes we pay enough to have roads provided?

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schmellba99 said:

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Teslag said:

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Waffledynamics said:

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Don't worry! The tolls will go away after it's paid off.

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They did for I-30

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That would be about the only one then.

The San Luis Bridge toll booth is finally going to be removed. The bridge was paid off 40+ years ago.

And now there are talks of a new bridge, so the tolls will be back before too long again. Only higher than the $2 it was.

I get the concept of toll roads, but still dislike the **** out of them. The 288 toll road is stupid expensive to use. Even for the use of the ramp from 288 to BW8 it is $2.50 - that's for the ramp only. If you drove from where it begins in Pearland to where it ends in the Med Center it is something like $28 one way. One.Way. And they didn't even bother to salt the overpasses during the last freeze either.

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You haven't made any point yet. Keep trying, I guess?

Keep reading, I guess?

fc2112 said:

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Keep reading, I guess?

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Considering I wrote the post, not much need to read it again.

So please, tell me where your point is applicable. Be specific.

I don't live within 1.5 hours of the nearest toll road and I have a bill for $10 sitting on my desk and another for $20 on the way. I don't see how people who live near them afford to drive. They suck majorly when you consider the costs of registration and other taxes we pay.

Here's some info relative to TxDOT this is basically their budget request for the next two years. State gas tax ($0.2 per gallon of which $0.15 goes to TxDOT and $0.05 goes to education) makes up 1/4 of their funding.



Here is some HCTRA info related to the toll roads they own and operate - looks like their oldest debt is now in the 2007 range. Their previous FY report still had some from the late 90s on it.

NTTA Financial Info

And what happens when the project is paid off and the tolls remain and get siphoned off for other BS that has nothing to do with infrastructure?

Cromagnum said:

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And what happens when the project is paid off and the tolls remain and get siphoned off for other BS that has nothing to do with infrastructure?

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That NEVER happens. If there's one consistency in the world, it's govt as the most efficient way to get things done right!!!!!1

For those that care and believe toll roads are a scam, were trying to get the words out there to fight the corruption that is Ft Bend County. I know we're most likely fighting a losing battle but we'll go down swinging if nothing else. Made the Ft Bend Hearld earlier this week and there was a story on ABC 13 a month or so ago, and now another one.

https://www.houstonpublicmedia.org/articles/news/fort-bend/2025/07/31/527515/nobody-really-wants-a-toll-road-fairchilds-residents-fight-highway-that-could-displace-families/

jt2hunt said:

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HTownAg98 said:

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jt2hunt said:

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Why do you think it's outgrown the gas tax? Are you trying to imply that the revenue collected from gas tax over all of the years has only been used on road construction and was not able to keep up?

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I don't know what all the gas tax money gets used for. I do know what TxDOT's needs for road construction far outstrip what they have funds to build today. Right of way acquisition, except for a few projects, is basically on hold until September 1.

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My understanding is that in the 80s the money started going into the general fund and was used for anything and everything. Prior to that it had all been used for road construction. Texas used to have the best roads in the world.

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Thanks for the laugh.....

JBAG064 said:

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https://www.houstonpublicmedia.org/articles/news/fort-bend/2025/07/31/527515/nobody-really-wants-a-toll-road-fairchilds-residents-fight-highway-that-could-displace-families/

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Quote:

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For a little over two years, Gail and Michael Pearce have lived on three and a half acres of land in the Village of Fairchilds.

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Wow, how can they ask a family with such a rich history in Texas land to move!!!!

EDIT: Read the article, WTF are they building a toll road out there? For 50,000 people in some master planned community? Seems like it will never make enough revenue to even maintain it.

JBAG064 said:

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I know. Its just a kick in the you know what after working so hard for something to see it ruined, but such is life I guess and realize there are people in the world with bigger issues.

My profession is in ag and I also see whats happening in TX and the loss of production agriculture very troubling but thats a different topic for another day I suppose.

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Amen. Developers gobbling up, just because they can.
We grow houses in Texas.

dmart90 said:

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AlaskanAg99 said:

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Now for some fun facts, HCTRA has a "surplus" annually after M&O and CIP is taken into account. Local commissioners can only spend these funds on "mobilitiy" projects and that becomes a gray area. So a lot of sidewalks are being built that tie into the toll roads. It's a real stretch. Now the fun part is at the State, there's a bill in consideration that the City of Houston wants a chunk of the surplus where it will go into their general fund. Theres a lot of debate at commissioners court and animosity between the entire court and Whitmeyer.

The real question is if they're running a 300M surplus, they're overcharging on the tolls themselves. If the state passes the law I wouldn't be surprised if court lowers toll rates just to stick it to Houston.

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F that noise. HCTRA now runs the tolls in and around Austin. So the City of Houston wants money from around the state to go into their general fund? That's nothing but a money grab.

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I see someone didn't pay attention to the announcement when HCTRA took over.

They're just managing the billing system. Toll funds go to the exact same place they've gone since the Austin area roads were built. They can't possibly do worse than IBM and the other contractors who have been running it the last 20yrs

You also aren't forced to use them. NTTA is significantly better than HCRTA in every way and their transponders work just fine in Austin and Houston.

agracer said:

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JBAG064 said:

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https://www.houstonpublicmedia.org/articles/news/fort-bend/2025/07/31/527515/nobody-really-wants-a-toll-road-fairchilds-residents-fight-highway-that-could-displace-families/

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Quote:

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For a little over two years, Gail and Michael Pearce have lived on three and a half acres of land in the Village of Fairchilds.

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Wow, how can they ask a family with such a rich history in Texas land to move!!!!

EDIT: Read the article, WTF are they building a toll road out there? For 50,000 people in some master planned community? Seems like it will never make enough revenue to even maintain it.

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If that was the only community, you might have a point. But it won't be. Almost every section of land along the route will be developed. What you see on maps now as a lot of open farmland will be anything but in 20 years. Look at any major road in/out of Houston since 1970.

Look at the 290 corridor for a more recent example of what the growth will look like. Everything along 99 - Bridgeland, Cypress Lakes, etc. - none of that was on the map 10 years ago. But 99 came through and the development followed with it, same thing will happen on the SW corner of the 99 loop - Needville, Fairchilds, Guy, etc. won't be little popcorn farming towns in the middle of nowhere anymore. They will be full on suburbs just like Pearland and Manvel are now and Iowa Colony will be shortly on the 288 corridor.

And TXDOT will still F up everything they touch.

They spend God knows how many millions on putting overpasses in on 288 and failed to address the 2 single biggest things that cause traffic problems - in fact, they didn't even change either of those things.

They also put in roadway for 3 lanes of traffic, but in their benevolent overlording genius selves have decided that even though traffic jams up every single day like clockwork going north and south - it's just not time yet to stripe in that 3rd lane.

Guess we have to wait until a certain number of people die before they will finally make that decision, and it will cost at least 5x as much to retrofit that 3rd lane than it would have to just incorporate the painting in the new construction they just did.

Yay! Government!

The growth is coming, we realize that. Mostly because of the Fort Bend Co Toll road making it over the Brazos. We are all smart enough to realize we can't stop it but hoping they will move it so that it affects the least amount of homes and has the least amount of exits till it reaches spur 10.

Teslag said:

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Waffledynamics said:

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Don't worry! The tolls will go away after it's paid off.

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They did for I-30

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The turnpike in Dallas between FW and DAL was the only one i remember going away...lol

sushi94 said:

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Eminent Domain - the fight is useless.

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My favorite eminent domain story involves getting paid to do the same thing... twice.

Our company builds houses primarily for government programs. We built a house in Brazoria off a Farm-to-Market road which was already a pain in the ass. But we placed the house well within the build lines including staying out of any existing ROW.

About 6 months after we complete the house, the State of Texas decides the FM road needed two lanes in each direction, a middle turn lane, wide shoulders and BAR ditches. This expanded the ROW which then pushed the build lines back encroaching on a corner of the newly built home.

No waivers, no reconsideration, no reroute. State agency told another state agency to piss off and rebuild the house if they wanted. Ultimately up to the homeowner, but we did indeed go out, tore a house down that was barely a year old, moved the site of the home about 10 feet, and built it again.

About $300k of your tax dollars wasted.

I actually have a great story about creatively addressing eminent domain holdouts by the Port Freeport guys.

schmellba99 said:

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agracer said:

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JBAG064 said:

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https://www.houstonpublicmedia.org/articles/news/fort-bend/2025/07/31/527515/nobody-really-wants-a-toll-road-fairchilds-residents-fight-highway-that-could-displace-families/

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Quote:

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For a little over two years, Gail and Michael Pearce have lived on three and a half acres of land in the Village of Fairchilds.

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Wow, how can they ask a family with such a rich history in Texas land to move!!!!

EDIT: Read the article, WTF are they building a toll road out there? For 50,000 people in some master planned community? Seems like it will never make enough revenue to even maintain it.

---

If that was the only community, you might have a point. But it won't be. Almost every section of land along the route will be developed. What you see on maps now as a lot of open farmland will be anything but in 20 years. Look at any major road in/out of Houston since 1970.

Look at the 290 corridor for a more recent example of what the growth will look like. Everything along 99 - Bridgeland, Cypress Lakes, etc. - none of that was on the map 10 years ago. But 99 came through and the development followed with it, same thing will happen on the SW corner of the 99 loop - Needville, Fairchilds, Guy, etc. won't be little popcorn farming towns in the middle of nowhere anymore. They will be full on suburbs just like Pearland and Manvel are now and Iowa Colony will be shortly on the 288 corridor.

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Cypress Lakes and Bridgeland have been there for 20+ years. I almost moved there in 2004 and it was pretty well established by then even.

If anything 290 just made it a lot easier to get into town. It sucked until that was done.

schmellba99 said:

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fc2112 said:

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Keep reading, I guess?

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Considering I wrote the post, not much need to read it again.

So please, tell me where your point is applicable. Be specific.

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Don't try and reason with that simpleton. He supports more taxes.

Teslag said:

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CDUB98 said:

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Quote:

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I think there are a scam

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Every toll road is a scam.

hth

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I see this said a lot but why? I like them. You can pay to bypass the riff raff and get somewhere faster.

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The worst thing about toll roads is that the prices arent higher so even the riff raff can afford them

As I've said before , I like toll roads as long as they set the tolls high enough that it's a privilege to use them, most toll roads these days are just as packed as regular freeways, except you pay to sit in their traffic. They are usually acceptable during non traffic hours only

fullback44 said:

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I like toll roads- I just wish they would raise the rates so the peasants can't afford them and there is less traffic on them

Kind of like skipping the line when you use VIP service

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More like having priority 100K, 1 or 2 boarding service for United.