Ramcharger entering production next year, pulled ahead of Ram REV which was bumped to 2026.

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/business/autos/chrysler/2024/12/18/stellantis-delays-all-electric-ram-to-launch-range-extended-pickup-first/77064900007/?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR3AK1Wn71QVZ-0JzBpo-9R09Q-8lznceA6M0CGJT1cRDOJRB-wqff1nZdw_aem_L9UKTh_fBkR9UtaQVWWwLA#dvf5qxq77hnkgvhscpzt7cls2v69p5ka

I am leaning more and more towards a Ramcharger being my next truck. I'm sure there will be some early adopter penalties, and it is a Stellantis product so it may burn my house down, but the mix of power, range, efficiency, and capability is really appealing to me.

Anyone know when orders might start? I did the Insider+ thing but as far as I can tell I basically just threw $100 bucks away.

Trump plans to rollback the EV mandates and strip the rebates & cut federal subsidies. Also going to cut the EPA regulations as well. Put tariffs on China EV materials.

GarlandAg2012 said:

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Anyone know when orders might start? I did the Insider+ thing but as far as I can tell I basically just threw $100 bucks away.

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I feel the same way. Did the $100 and haven't received a single email.

You would think they could easily email the information from the article at the bare minimum.

DallasAggie89 said:

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GarlandAg2012 said:

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Anyone know when orders might start? I did the Insider+ thing but as far as I can tell I basically just threw $100 bucks away.

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I feel the same way. Did the $100 and haven't received a single email.

You would think they could easily email the information from the article at the bare minimum.

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Maybe check your spam? I have gotten a few emails, last one was sent August 5 though so if you signed up after that. It has been disappointing that they haven't done more.

Also threw away $100 and have seen nothing. But I vaguely remember it saying they would refund the price at anytime? Probably too lazy to search for that though. Maybe over the holidays if I get really bored at the in-laws I'll search all my emails for the refund terms.

Roger350 said:

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Also threw away $100 and have seen nothing. But I vaguely remember it saying they would refund the price at anytime? Probably too lazy to search for that though. Maybe over the holidays if I get really bored at the in-laws I'll search all my emails for the refund terms.

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I think I read you could get a refund up to the point they let you know it's available for you to order.

Didn't take long to find on the website, I'll have to come up with a better excuse to avoid paying attention to my in-laws.

You may cancel your membership by contacting Ram REV Insider+ Headquarters Customer Support at 800-763-2142. After your cancellation request is approved, please allow up to 7 business days for your refund to be processed. You will receive an email confirming your cancellation. The membership fee is refundable up until you are notified that the Ram 1500 REV or the Ram 1500 Ramcharger becomes available for early access preorder communicated by the Ram Brand via the email provided at sign up.

Ramcharger has moved ahead of Rev in production. I suspect that's why they've been so quiet. Been reading the market and trying to decide what to do. Plus the chaotic situation with Stellantis leadership right now.

Ramchargers are supposed to be hitting media hands late Jan/Feb. I would think you'd hear something about ordering around then.

If you want one I'd give it a few more weeks before pulling your $100

Tavares is gone so there is a glimmer of hope that they can remain in business.

• Ram REV 1500 is dead.
• Hemi 5.7, 6.2 & 6.4 will all be back in 2025.
• There is likely to be a Challenger/Charger replacement called Cuda.
• You will see a Ram 1500 Hellcat (or whatever they will call it).
• Prices across the board will be reduced by 35% in 2025 (it will be interesting to see what Ford and GM do to answer this).

Buyer beware because Tavares made so many bone headed decisions (they may not be able to overcome his bad, bad decisions), he has really hurt quality. It will take a while for this to recover.

Rumor with the Scout is the range extended models will be priced the same as the pure EV. With the reduced battery size offsetting the cost of the ICE. Which is surprising given the engineering cost of integrating the ICE late in the development process.

With the RAM already able to accept an ICE and the volume of pentastars available... The math is probably even more favorable

An idiot discusses the Ramcharger a bit

Ram finally dropped some hard info on yesterday. What stuck out to me were the details on the different drive modes.

They said early on that the generator would be able to bypass the batteries and supply electricity directly to the EDMs(a la locomotive). I thought they were presenting it as just a temporary power-boost, but it sounds like they're going to lean heavily on that kind of power delivery.

This is going to be something to follow as media drives begin. A few month ago a Ramcharger engineer was interviewed by TFL and they said something strange when asked about the RPMs and loads the generator would operate in. They suggested that when the generator was running you would notice the revs changing as you pulled away from a stop, similar to a regular ICE. That didn't make much since to me at the time, but now it does.

Under certain modes/conditions it sounds like almost all generator power will be going to the wheels and charging will be slow or non existent. To make that happen you'll need the ICE to run across a wider range. That's going to impact the experience inside for sure.

What kind of home fire suppression system is recommended?

This is basically the powertrain Edison motors in Canada has developed for semi's

'03ag said:

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Ram finally dropped some hard info on yesterday. What stuck out to me were the details on the different drive modes.

They said early on that the generator would be able to bypass the batteries and supply electricity directly to the EDMs(a la locomotive). I thought they were presenting it as just a temporary power-boost, but it sounds like they're going to lean heavily on that kind of power delivery.

This is going to be something to follow as media drives begin. A few month ago a Ramcharger engineer was interviewed by TFL and they said something strange when asked about the RPMs and loads the generator would operate in. They suggested that when the generator was running you would notice the revs changing as you pulled away from a stop, similar to a regular ICE. That didn't make much since to me at the time, but now it does.

Under certain modes/conditions it sounds like almost all generator power will be going to the wheels and charging will be slow or non existent. To make that happen you'll need the ICE to run across a wider range. That's going to impact the experience inside for sure.

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Having the revs rise and fall is definitely something that could impact the driving experience, but it's the same engine as in the wrangler, so I would think the NVH will be manageable. Plus, in normal commuting use most people are likely to be in EV only mode. On longer trips where you need the generator, I would guess the majority will be highway miles which should be a pretty flat power demand from the engine.

It is definitely an interesting aspect of the design but I'm not sure I see it as a downside yet. I feel like it would be more efficient to keep the engine at a single RPM but maybe to be able to get max power that would require a larger engine so it's more efficient to rev a smaller engine on demand than keep a bigger engine running at a constant RPM?

Not having a transmission or other traditional driveline components will be huge for managing NHV. But it'll be noisier for sure.

But yeah in actual use, most people won't touch the ICE except on weekends or trips. It's still an outstanding tradeoff IMO.

Corps_Ag12 said:

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This is basically the powertrain Edison motors in Canada has developed for semi's

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Yep! They've been neat to follow on social media.

It seems the motor would be relatively steady state unless the power requirements were very high. If the engine makes too much power it will just go to the battery instead and maintain steady state rpm. Only in a low battery state and needing max power would the engine need to try to push more power.

Also from what I have seen in a recent video, the generator has a power cycle so the engine would vary based on generator duty cycle. It can only generate at max power for a certain period then it has to reduce power anyway. So engine pushing extra power would have a time limit based on generator duty cycle. Note the electric motors also have a duty cycle for time at max power.

In normal driving, even towing I doubt most people are using more than 75% of engine power constantly. Only very long steep grades or very high wind resistance towing (maybe both) would this setup have any issues at all where it needed to push the engine beyond optimum power.

Sounds like they're using variable frequency drives to make electric motor speeds. Typically generators run certain rpms divisible by the target AC frequency so that the AC sine wave is generated by points in the shaft rotation. Servo control systems often use inverters to vary frequency to control motor speed. So you could use variable frequency drives coupled to a variable rpm generator to deliver different engine speeds. Of course they could just be throwing the generator output into an inverter ands using PLCs to control the output, but who knows.

On one hand, this seems like a great idea.

On the other, seems like you're losing some of the benefits of an EV only auto. Namely, a lot less maintenance and having stop at the gas station. You still have to change the oil, coolant, and all the other O&M requirement of a normal ICE car + battery replacement at some point.

But your fuel costs are cut way down.

I pay ~0.10/kwh. 145 miles costs me ~$8 for electric plug in per the data. Gas would cost me ~$20 at 18mpg. in current truck. 99% of my driving is to/from work or inside that 145-mile range.

Let's just say 80% of annual driving is electric only vs gas. 12,000 miles/yr
Ramcharger
10,800 miles at 145/70.8 KwH = $527
1,200 miles at 18mpg (maybe better for Ramcharger?), $2.50 gallon = $167
Total =$694

Current Ram gets on a really good day 17mpg.
12,000/17 = 705 gallons x 2.5 = $1,764.

That's an annual savings of $1,070.

My electricity is cheap. People on the west/east coast paying a whole lot more will see a much bigger savings.

someone correct my math if it's wrong.

agracer said:

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On one hand, this seems like a great idea.

On the other, seems like you're losing some of the benefits of an EV only auto. Namely, a lot less maintenance and having stop at the gas station. You still have to change the oil, coolant, and all the other O&M requirement of a normal ICE car + battery replacement at some point.

But your fuel costs are cut way down.

I pay ~0.10/kwh. 145 miles costs me ~$8 for electric plug in per the data. Gas would cost me ~$20 at 18mpg. in current truck. 99% of my driving is to/from work or inside that 145-mile range.

Let's just say 80% of annual driving is electric only vs gas. 12,000 miles/yr
Ramcharger
10,800 miles at 145/70.8 KwH = $527
1,200 miles at 18mpg (maybe better for Ramcharger?), $2.50 gallon = $167
Total =$694

Current Ram gets on a really good day 17mpg.
12,000/17 = 705 gallons x 2.5 = $1,764.

That's an annual savings of $1,070.

My electricity is cheap. People on the west/east coast paying a whole lot more will see a much bigger savings.

someone correct my math if it's wrong.

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yes, but... you're probably talking about an annual oil change at worst, maybe every 18 months. Also, I don't think they are using a standard 12v battery. I think power for starting and providing electrical to the engine is pulled from main battery/ genset / bus architecture.

cavscout96 said:

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agracer said:

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On one hand, this seems like a great idea.

On the other, seems like you're losing some of the benefits of an EV only auto. Namely, a lot less maintenance and having stop at the gas station. You still have to change the oil, coolant, and all the other O&M requirement of a normal ICE car + battery replacement at some point.

But your fuel costs are cut way down.

I pay ~0.10/kwh. 145 miles costs me ~$8 for electric plug in per the data. Gas would cost me ~$20 at 18mpg. in current truck. 99% of my driving is to/from work or inside that 145-mile range.

Let's just say 80% of annual driving is electric only vs gas. 12,000 miles/yr
Ramcharger
10,800 miles at 145/70.8 KwH = $527
1,200 miles at 18mpg (maybe better for Ramcharger?), $2.50 gallon = $167
Total =$694

Current Ram gets on a really good day 17mpg.
12,000/17 = 705 gallons x 2.5 = $1,764.

That's an annual savings of $1,070.

My electricity is cheap. People on the west/east coast paying a whole lot more will see a much bigger savings.

someone correct my math if it's wrong.

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yes, but... you're probably talking about an annual oil change at worst, maybe every 18 months. Also, I don't think they are using a standard 12v battery. I think power for starting and providing electrical to the engine is pulled from main battery/ genset / bus architecture.

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Tesla actually has a separate 12V battery. I'm not sure about other EVs. My guess is they do so to be able to keep using accessories like a phone charger when not using the car without have to first down convert the voltage through a relatively inefficient inverter. That and they don't want to lock you out or in during complete main battery drain events.

Ford does this too

Corps_Ag12 said:

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This is basically the powertrain Edison motors in Canada has developed for semi's

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I think Edison is partnered with this guy to make a kit to convert an HD truck to diesel electric.

https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLYbEYVyB_NH87iZ6gO2jT9wNx3iiudpmP&si=Zv-8zlGgyT_Q4qTA

BQAg09 said:

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Corps_Ag12 said:

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This is basically the powertrain Edison motors in Canada has developed for semi's

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I think Edison is partnered with this guy to make a kit to convert an HD truck to diesel electric.

https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLYbEYVyB_NH87iZ6gO2jT9wNx3iiudpmP&si=Zv-8zlGgyT_Q4qTA

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Interesting, I saw they were developing a kit on their website and they've already built a dealer network for it too. Be interesting to see how it shakes out.

I meant the Li-On battery that powers the electric motors.

They are projecting that at 8+ years.

cavscout96 said:

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They are projecting that at 8+ years.

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yes, but still a long term ownership cost. Like replacing a timing belt.

yes, but that's exactly what it is an LT cost of ownership. ICE engines have those too as ell as a host of other maintenance costs along with more complex systems that are (allegedly) more prone to needing repair.

The all electric truck has been cancelled. All production will be for the Ramcharger, which will now take the Ram REV name that the all electric truck had.

interesting turn of events.