Highland Park boys forfeit championship immediately after winning

8,029 Views | 98 Replies | Last: 7 hrs ago by 91AggieLawyer
Raptor
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https://www.fox4news.com/sports/highland-park-forfeits-boys-state-soccer-title
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ThunderCougarFalconBird
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Damn Scots……

wangus12
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Not surprising that the rich kids are cheating
Omperlodge
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It is a strange situation. The kid gets his grades up to be able to play at the end of the week before the championship. After a seven-day waiting period would have made him eligible that day to play, but the day doesn't count until the end of the regular school day. The rule was thinking that athletics occur after school, but this game was at 1 pm.

Huge mess up by the AD and the coach to not confirm that he was eligible before inserting him into the game, especially when from what I have heard he wasn't a key contributor.

Also, the interesting thing is that a teacher from the school was the one that reported it. While he shouldn't be able to play, she must hate this kid. My guess is that she will be vilified by the student body.
34blast
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Yeah, it was weird, he was eligible at 4 PM not 1 PM (when game was played)
Jim01
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Just a crappy situation all around. Not just for the rest of the kids on that team, but for the team that was awarded the trophy. I would have very mixed emotions on that team, feeling like I won on a technicality because of a kid that had no impact on the game.
Ghost of Andrew Eaton
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34blast said:

Yeah, it was weird, he was eligible at 4 PM not 1 PM (when game was played)
Every year we do a UIL training over these situations and it clearly states the end of instruction on Friday.
If you say you hate the state of politics in this nation and you don't get involved in it, you obviously don't hate the state of politics in this nation.
TurboVelo
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So, the rest of the story: he is and was always eligible under UIL rules. Highland Park holds a higher academic standing, and deemed him ineligible per that.
jeffk
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That doesn't make sense to me. The UIL wouldn't care about district standards that are higher than their own. And the UIL certainly wouldn't be reporting it as a vacated title due to playing an ineligible player if that player had met their eligibility standards.
TurboVelo
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jeffk said:

That doesn't make sense to me. The UIL wouldn't care about district standards that are higher than their own. And the UIL certainly wouldn't be reporting it as a vacated title due to playing an ineligible player if that player had met their eligibility standards.
It's worth noting that Highland Park's new AD has 0 years of experience in athletics or dealing with the UIL. I believe he simply told the UIL that they played a player who was academically ineligible, because that's what the teacher told him immediately after the game.
jeffk
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Their AD has been a principal in the district for nearly 20 years and the past four were at HP HS.

I get that he hasn't been a coach before, but he's not unfamiliar with how UIL and their rules work.
Ghost of Andrew Eaton
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TurboVelo said:

So, the rest of the story: he is and was always eligible under UIL rules. Highland Park holds a higher academic standing, and deemed him ineligible per that.


I'm sorry but that sounds like HP propaganda. As long as the kid was above 69, he would be eligible in the eyes of the UIL. And the principal and teacher know that, if I'm a betting man.
If you say you hate the state of politics in this nation and you don't get involved in it, you obviously don't hate the state of politics in this nation.
TurboVelo
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Ghost of Andrew Eaton said:

TurboVelo said:

So, the rest of the story: he is and was always eligible under UIL rules. Highland Park holds a higher academic standing, and deemed him ineligible per that.


I'm sorry but that sounds like HP propaganda. As long as the kid was above 69, he would be eligible in the eyes of the UIL. And the principal and teacher know that, if I'm a betting man.
The School Board is meeting tonight to look at firing the AD and Superintendent. https://meetings.boardbook.org/Public/PublicNotice/2024?meeting=685310

The player has never failed a class.
jessexy
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jeffk said:

Their AD has been a principal in the district for nearly 20 years and the past four were at HP HS.

I get that he hasn't been a coach before, but he's not unfamiliar with how UIL and their rules work.
Correct. UIL isn't just athletics. Principals deal with the UIL on academic, music, performing arts, debate, and other competitions. A student's grades & academic eligibility factor into participation in all of them.
Ghost of Andrew Eaton
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TurboVelo said:

Ghost of Andrew Eaton said:

TurboVelo said:

So, the rest of the story: he is and was always eligible under UIL rules. Highland Park holds a higher academic standing, and deemed him ineligible per that.


I'm sorry but that sounds like HP propaganda. As long as the kid was above 69, he would be eligible in the eyes of the UIL. And the principal and teacher know that, if I'm a betting man.
The School Board is meeting tonight to look at firing the AD and Superintendent. https://meetings.boardbook.org/Public/PublicNotice/2024?meeting=685310

The player has never failed a class.


What was decided?
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TurboVelo
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Ghost of Andrew Eaton said:

TurboVelo said:

Ghost of Andrew Eaton said:

TurboVelo said:

So, the rest of the story: he is and was always eligible under UIL rules. Highland Park holds a higher academic standing, and deemed him ineligible per that.


I'm sorry but that sounds like HP propaganda. As long as the kid was above 69, he would be eligible in the eyes of the UIL. And the principal and teacher know that, if I'm a betting man.
The School Board is meeting tonight to look at firing the AD and Superintendent. https://meetings.boardbook.org/Public/PublicNotice/2024?meeting=685310

The player has never failed a class.


What was decided?
Nothing was finalized or announced, when I started typing this, although that could change at any minute.

Here's what I understand:
1. Grading period ended 3 weeks ago.
2. Player was never ineligible per UIL standards, and has played every game this season, including playoffs and all travel, according to public statements made by the parents after the AD named the student publicly (parents have started a lawsuit)
3. Player was apparently told by the teacher that he wasn't allowed to play the day before the game (despite being in the middle of a grading period, and having played 5 days before).
4. Player was specifically told by the coach that he was allowed to play. He traveled with the team to the game.
5. Teacher told AD immediately after the game that the player wasn't eligible.
6. AD informed the UIL that the player was ineligible without any details on why the player was ineligible or by what standards. Only that he was ineligible and that Highland Park was forfeiting. UIL did not ask for clarification, and simply stated that if HP wanted to forfeit, they'd accept it.
7. AD pulled the Trophy and Medals from the bus en route back in Dallas, and returned those to the Stadium. My understanding is those have already been awarded to the other team.
8. Parents and Public were notified through social media of the forfeiture as they were driving back to Dallas.
9. Parents are looking at suing the District / Superintendent / AD
10. Parents want the UIL to reinstate the team as State Champions (I see zero chance of that happening).

Clearly there has been a huge breakdown in the governance of athletics in Highland Park.

Caveats & disclosures:
1. I am an HP grad, but have no direct connection to anyone on the team. Obviously, I have some level of emotional interest.
2. My sister is a parent in the district, friends with parents on the team, and her husband is a recently retired Superintendent (of another district). He has had a working relationship with the AD and Superintendent, but no contact with them on this situation.
3. Another sister is also a parent in the district, and friends with parents on the team, including being neighbors with 2 players / families, so I am hearing a lot from their perspectives, which is obviously biased.
3. I do know several of the current and past board members (HP is a very small community), but have had no contact with any of them on this. It'll be interesting to grab beers after the dust settles.
4. My best friend (also HP Grad) is the head coach of the Colleyville Heritage Girls team, who played immediately afterwards, so I happened to be down there when all of this happened. I was not involved in anyway with the HP team.
5. I have no professional experience in school sports. My background is elite level cycling, having been a US National Team Coach, and UCI Team Director (of the #1 team in the world, I will brag). My only experience with UIL eligibility was when I screwed around in 7th grade and found out. That was a very long time ago, and things change.

My thoughts:
1. There does not seem to be strong leadership within the Athletic Department if teachers and coaches are confused about eligibility. If the Player was ineligible by any standard, and the coach played him, that seems like an immediate termination.
2. If the player was UIL eligible, but HP ineligible, and the coach told him to play, it seems the proper course of action would be to punish the coach, not the players, especially the other players who may have no idea about the situation.
3. I hear what y'all are saying about a Principal is plenty experienced enough to be an AD, but it does not appear that is the situation here. In dealing with the IOC and UCI on a daily basis, I know there are a lot of politics, and things must be handled carefully. I would assume that being the AD at Highland Park would also require that level of care.
4. The current sentiment in HP right now is that there is a disdain for athletics from the Administration, which seems absolutely crazy.

Questions:
1. In reading through the UIL rules (and acknowledging that reading them isn't enough to fully understand all the nuances), why would a player's eligibility change in the middle of a grading period?
2. My uninformed guess is also that this somehow relates to an Honors Class, as that is the only place I see the UIL making allowances for Districts to have alternative standards of eligibility. Are there others?

I probably left some stuff off, but I've got tired head.
Omperlodge
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I am an HP grad as well. Sounds like a teacher needs to be fired.
Ghost of Andrew Eaton
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If that is all true, it's one of the most bizarre situations I've come across and that teachers should have stayed in their lane. And they AD needed to verify.

Your last question, some classes are considered exempt from UIL, primarily AP and some Pre-AP classes. I believe dual-credit as well. Eligibility can only be lost at the six weeks, not at progress report. So if all of that is true, AD should lose his job and HP probably should regain the trophies.

What a cluster ****. HP was our rival in the early 90s and it seemed that they were supported well by the district. Maybe Chris Young should put some pressure on them.
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PatAg
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TurboVelo said:

Ghost of Andrew Eaton said:

TurboVelo said:

So, the rest of the story: he is and was always eligible under UIL rules. Highland Park holds a higher academic standing, and deemed him ineligible per that.


I'm sorry but that sounds like HP propaganda. As long as the kid was above 69, he would be eligible in the eyes of the UIL. And the principal and teacher know that, if I'm a betting man.
The School Board is meeting tonight to look at firing the AD and Superintendent. https://meetings.boardbook.org/Public/PublicNotice/2024?meeting=685310

The player has never failed a class.
you are related to the player or have a kid on the team, clearly
jeffk
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Lol. If any of that is true, then it'll all be in the DMN within a week.
Knucklesammich
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jessexy said:

jeffk said:

Their AD has been a principal in the district for nearly 20 years and the past four were at HP HS.

I get that he hasn't been a coach before, but he's not unfamiliar with how UIL and their rules work.
Correct. UIL isn't just athletics. Principals deal with the UIL on academic, music, performing arts, debate, and other competitions. A student's grades & academic eligibility factor into participation in all of them.


This
Knucklesammich
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There a multitude of reasons why a player can be ruled ineligible by the school, AD, coach etc.

Reasons across three sports/extracurriculars in our our district:

Drinking on school property (after a football game), lewd conduct, fighting, vandalism, reckless driving.

I can't speak for all the above but drinking, lewd conduct both involved UIL oversight.

I feel there is more to the story here than an AD just blindly notifying the UIL based on what a teacher says.
TurboVelo
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PatAg said:

TurboVelo said:

Ghost of Andrew Eaton said:

TurboVelo said:

So, the rest of the story: he is and was always eligible under UIL rules. Highland Park holds a higher academic standing, and deemed him ineligible per that.


I'm sorry but that sounds like HP propaganda. As long as the kid was above 69, he would be eligible in the eyes of the UIL. And the principal and teacher know that, if I'm a betting man.
The School Board is meeting tonight to look at firing the AD and Superintendent. https://meetings.boardbook.org/Public/PublicNotice/2024?meeting=685310

The player has never failed a class.
you are related to the player or have a kid on the team, clearly


Your reading comprehension needs work
TurboVelo
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HP Admin released a clarification email today stating that their standard is such than any student with an average below 70 in any class at any time is ineligible until that student is above 70 in all classes. The player failed a test in an honors class earlier in the week, making him ineligible per HP's standards. According to the email, the coach "missed" the updated ineligible list. Clearly the system at HP needs work.

All personnel decisions will be made at the end of the school year.

The UIL has said they will honor any school's higher academic standards on eligiblility.
Ghost of Andrew Eaton
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TurboVelo said:

HP Admin released a clarification email today stating that their standard is such than any student with an average below 70 in any class at any time is ineligible until that student is above 70 in all classes. The player failed a test in an honors class earlier in the week, making him ineligible per HP's standards. According to the email, the coach "missed" the updated ineligible list. Clearly the system at HP needs work.

All personnel decisions will be made at the end of the school year.

The UIL has said they will honor any school's higher academic standards on eligiblility.


I stand corrected. Good for them, I guess.
If you say you hate the state of politics in this nation and you don't get involved in it, you obviously don't hate the state of politics in this nation.
Wrighty
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TurboVelo said:

HP Admin released a clarification email today stating that their standard is such than any student with an average below 70 in any class at any time is ineligible until that student is above 70 in all classes. The player failed a test in an honors class earlier in the week, making him ineligible per HP's standards. According to the email, the coach "missed" the updated ineligible list. Clearly the system at HP needs work.

All personnel decisions will be made at the end of the school year.

The UIL has said they will honor any school's higher academic standards on eligiblility.


So let's say it's a new grading period, and kid fails first test, that means he's ineligible ? That's crazy.
Wrighty
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Is the teachers name Karen?
jeffk
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That's an insane policy and would make it almost impossible to coach an athletic team at the high school level. You'd have to couple it with some sort of immediate retesting policy if you wanted to be able to field a squad.

Also, that's not what's outlined in the current HPHS student handbook on athletic eligibility. They keep to normal UIL calendar seems. (Starts on p. 23.)

https://4.files.edl.io/0026/01/23/25/171815-6de6531b-4e57-4efc-9a14-fb44ae44a94c.pdf#page23
Ghost of Andrew Eaton
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It would be impossible to know who is eligible and who isn't.
If you say you hate the state of politics in this nation and you don't get involved in it, you obviously don't hate the state of politics in this nation.
jeffk
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Yeah, I'm all for high academic standards, but with zero lead time? No, thank you. I'd coach somewhere else.
Knucklesammich
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jeffk said:

Yeah, I'm all for high academic standards, but with zero lead time? No, thank you. I'd coach somewhere else.


Imagine the ramifications in other sports as well like football for eligibility and film for a kid trying to get a scholarship. Why would the UIL be involved here? That's the schools decision as they have no say to enforce random standards…this makes no sense
PatAg
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maybe kids in high school should be taking school more seriously?
Homelander11
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why didn't he just sit out?
Ghost of Andrew Eaton
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Knucklesammich said:

jeffk said:

Yeah, I'm all for high academic standards, but with zero lead time? No, thank you. I'd coach somewhere else.


Imagine the ramifications in other sports as well like football for eligibility and film for a kid trying to get a scholarship. Why would the UIL be involved here? That's the schools decision as they have no say to enforce random standards…this makes no sense


I don't believe UIL rules in this. They just accepted HPs forfeit.
If you say you hate the state of politics in this nation and you don't get involved in it, you obviously don't hate the state of politics in this nation.
jessexy
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PatAg said:

maybe kids in high school should be taking school more seriously?
Maybe I'm hardcore but I agree with this. If you want to play, don't fail your classes. Or tests if you're at HP. Don't put yourself in jeopardy, or your team.

He Ll, it's so much easier these days too. I played in an era where it was truly No Pass, No Play. If you failed a class, you say out all 6 weeks and couldn't practice with the team or take extra credit to get back on the team. You pretty much missed the rest of the season with no chance for redemption.
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