Project Marvel

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Burdizzo
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In reply to Obi Wan Ginobili • 3:44p, 8/6/25
AG
Obi Wan Ginobili said:
Burdizzo said:
Where is my Spurs Ring or Trophy?

How much time do those trophies spend in the Courthouse or City Hall? Last one I went out of town, no one asked to see any of my five NBA Championship rings.

Who really benefits from the tax money that subsidizes the Spurs?


I feel like Spurs fanboys are like real estate agents trying to sell me a house with a pool when what I really want is a house in a safe neighborhood and a working air conditioner.



You know what's funny? The Spurs paid for and gave away 20k rings to fans after the won the title.

You couldn't even whine without being wrong.





Rings went to fans who happened to buy tickets at one specific game. Didn't go to taxpayers that subsidize the building they venue where they work. Somewhere I have a Patty Mills bobblehead doll too. They are probably of similar value. Woo, what a trophy.

Does he even still play for them?
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cav14
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In reply to Hank the Grifter • 5:21p, 8/6/25
Hank the Grifter said:
cav14 said:
Hank the Grifter said:
Burdizzo said:
TxDOT will probably be more cooperative crossing that ROW with a pedestrian land bridge than a pedestrian tunnel. Just my experience dealing with them.


TXDOT hates the idea.
And I'm glad they do.
I don't want a dime of taxpayer money to pay for this.
Let the Spurs go to Austin.
Sick of being held hostage.

Where do you get the idea that TXDOT hates the land bridge idea when they have already built it in Dallas and are currently in the process of planning/building one in Austin?

Because I know people.
That's the best you're gonna get out of me.
Believe me or not, makes no difference to me.

Sure I believe you that you know some people within TXDOT who don't like land bridges. But it's obvious that they have little to no influence on what actually gets decided at TXDOT since they have moved forward with building the land bridges in Dallas and Austin. So in the end to use you own words, what you have said so far really makes no difference to me and the outcome of this aspect of Project Marvel since the people you know don't make the big boy decisions. That will ultimately most likely come down to locals when it comes up for a bond vote to help pay for the bridge.
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Hank the Grifter
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In reply to cav14 • 9:06p, 8/7/25
You're aware that TXDOT is divided into districts, yes?
You're aware that those districts make decisions independently of other districts, yes?

Edit: you have no idea who I know in TXDOT or what roles they serve. Turn down the "smug" a bit.
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SanAntoneAg
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10:12p, 8/7/25
AG
Our new socialist mayor who checks all the boxes doesn't seem to be a fan of the project.
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Ginormus Ag
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10:13p, 8/7/25
AG
$5 billion, and we can't even get Skyrides out of the deal? That's what SA needs.
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cav14
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In reply to Hank the Grifter • 3:17a, 8/9/25
Hank the Grifter said:
You're aware that TXDOT is divided into districts, yes?
You're aware that those districts make decisions independently of other districts, yes?

Edit: you have no idea who I know in TXDOT or what roles they serve. Turn down the "smug" a bit.

Yes, I know. But like you said, it don't make a lick a difference because in the end it will come down to a bond vote and not your friends in TXDOT. So you can calm down there boomer and save your cloud yelling later during the vote. Just enjoy for now that TXDOT is spending billions of dollars on many other projects over SA that have nothing to do with Project Marvel.
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Rattler12
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8:04a, 8/9/25
The Spurs didn't like the Hemisfair Arena so the city/taxpayers built them the Alamo Dome.
Rinse and repeat...
The Spurs didn't like the Alamo Dome so the city/taxpayers built them AT&T Center.
Rinse and repeat...
The Spurs don't like the AT&T Center so they want the city/taxpayers to build them another venue ......across the road from the Alamo Dome they didn't like.
Rinse and repeat
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Obi Wan Ginobili
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In reply to Rattler12 • 9:05p, 8/9/25
Rattler12 said:
The Spurs didn't like the Hemisfair Arena so the city/taxpayers built them the Alamo Dome.
Rinse and repeat...
The Spurs didn't like the Alamo Dome so the city/taxpayers built them AT&T Center.
Rinse and repeat...
The Spurs don't like the AT&T Center so they want the city/taxpayers to build them another venue ......across the road from the Alamo Dome they didn't like.
Rinse and repeat

Hemisphere Arena - 11k seating capacity, old as balls. Needed an upgrade.

Alamodome - Built to attract a football team and conventions, as well as a home for the Spurs. Did you ever see a game in there? They used half the stadium and curtains. It wasn't built for them....

ATT Center - Need to pack heat in the area, ZERO walkability


You simplified your argument to fit a weak narrative. You could have googled the Hemisphere and Alamodome crap, but why let all the facts get in the way of your opinion?
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Rattler12
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In reply to Obi Wan Ginobili • 8:26a, 8/10/25
Obi Wan Ginobili said:
Rattler12 said:
The Spurs didn't like the Hemisfair Arena so the city/taxpayers built them the Alamo Dome.
Rinse and repeat...
The Spurs didn't like the Alamo Dome so the city/taxpayers built them AT&T Center.
Rinse and repeat...
The Spurs don't like the AT&T Center so they want the city/taxpayers to build them another venue ......across the road from the Alamo Dome they didn't like.
Rinse and repeat

Hemisphere Arena - 11k seating capacity, old as balls. Needed an upgrade.

Alamodome - Built to attract a football team and conventions, as well as a home for the Spurs. Did you ever see a game in there? They used half the stadium and curtains. It wasn't built for them....

ATT Center - Need to pack heat in the area, ZERO walkability


You simplified your argument to fit a weak narrative. You could have googled the Hemisphere and Alamodome crap, but why let all the facts get in the way of your opinion?

Thanks for your reply but I think you missed the point.......how long will it take before they feel they need yet a 5th venue if this 4th one is built. Improve in the W/L column first then talk new arena.....

As far as your Hemisfair Arena and Alamodome comment....I was around when both were built and they were presented as the cat's meow at the time as was the ATT center. Hindsight is always 20/20. A little foresight and these "boondoggles" wouldn't have happened.
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Obi Wan Ginobili
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In reply to Rattler12 • 9:32a, 8/10/25
Rattler12 said:
Obi Wan Ginobili said:
Rattler12 said:
The Spurs didn't like the Hemisfair Arena so the city/taxpayers built them the Alamo Dome.
Rinse and repeat...
The Spurs didn't like the Alamo Dome so the city/taxpayers built them AT&T Center.
Rinse and repeat...
The Spurs don't like the AT&T Center so they want the city/taxpayers to build them another venue ......across the road from the Alamo Dome they didn't like.
Rinse and repeat

Hemisphere Arena - 11k seating capacity, old as balls. Needed an upgrade.

Alamodome - Built to attract a football team and conventions, as well as a home for the Spurs. Did you ever see a game in there? They used half the stadium and curtains. It wasn't built for them....

ATT Center - Need to pack heat in the area, ZERO walkability


You simplified your argument to fit a weak narrative. You could have googled the Hemisphere and Alamodome crap, but why let all the facts get in the way of your opinion?

Thanks for your reply but I think you missed the point.......how long will it take before they feel they need yet a 5th venue if this 4th one is built. Improve in the W/L column first then talk new arena.....

As far as your Hemisfair Arena and Alamodome comment....I was around when both were built and they were presented as the cat's meow at the time as was the ATT center. Hindsight is always 20/20. A little foresight and these "boondoggles" wouldn't have happened.


By the time the new arena will be built, the SBC/AT&T/Frost Center will be closing in on 25-30 years old. That's pretty much the useful life of an arena in an industry that is CONSTANTLY evolving. Other than the location (which is literally what the new arena plan aims to fix), can you please tell me how it was a "boondoggle" instead of just labelling it that?

How is 25+ years of useful life hosting professional sports teams, a massive annual stock show and rodeo, and countless concerts and events a boondoggle?


**Edit** I don't know why I'm still arguing. Project Marvel will happen no matter how many grumpy old men complain, everyone under the age of 65 will love it, tourists will fund it, and more people will get to enjoy it because it's specifically being built to do more than just play basketball.
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Burdizzo
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10:05a, 8/10/25
AG
Some of us grumpy old men are in our 50s

I agree Marvel will happen. They would not be tearing down ITTC if they didn't already have some level of confidence. And if we are committed to keeping the Spurs (which I think the community is) they do need a better stadium in a better location. Some portion of Marvel (namely a basketball arena) will happen, but I have my doubts all of it will get built. And I bet the rodeo moves downtown with it just so they will support it politically. Livestock show will probably still continue out at Freeman. This city struggles with long-term vision and long term execution. The economy relies too heavily on kitschy tourism and federal spending.

All that said, we have been down this road before, and some of don't like the taste of what we are fed by the proponents. The economic development around the Frost Center never materialized like was promoted. We never got a full-time tenant for the Alamo Dome after 30 years. And I was a little offended when the Spurs said their fan experience was one of the lowest in the league as if that were the city's responsibility. That doesn't begin to address Greg Popovich preaching to the community about stuff unrelated to basketball.
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SanAntoneAg
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In reply to Obi Wan Ginobili • 9:57p, 8/10/25
AG
Obi Wan Ginobili said:
Rattler12 said:
The Spurs didn't like the Hemisfair Arena so the city/taxpayers built them the Alamo Dome.
Rinse and repeat...
The Spurs didn't like the Alamo Dome so the city/taxpayers built them AT&T Center.
Rinse and repeat...
The Spurs don't like the AT&T Center so they want the city/taxpayers to build them another venue ......across the road from the Alamo Dome they didn't like.
Rinse and repeat


ATT Center - Need to pack heat in the area, ZERO walkability


But but but we need to build the ATT Center on the east side, it'll be perfect for revitalizing that part of town.

Yet another boondoggle.
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Beckdiesel03
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2:02p, 8/19/25
AG
What was the latest fight the news showed a clip of this morning between the Mayor and Whyte?
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valtosca
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2:50p, 8/19/25
AG
I enjoy going to Downtown Houston to catch Astros and Rockets Games. It's great to go downtown Houston, stay in a hotel there, walk to restaurants before (or after or both) and then to the stadium. For the Spurs, you have to go to a restaurant off site (the Pearl is my choice) and then drive to the arena (which often includes traffic). Very different experiences, and I like the experience in Houston better.

The Spurs do a better job than the Rockets do in regard to their in-game entertainment.

Will Mayor Jones be the one to lose the Spurs? Everyone knows Austin will take them in a heartbeat.
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Obi Wan Ginobili
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In reply to valtosca • 3:16p, 8/19/25
valtosca said:
I enjoy going to Downtown Houston to catch Astros and Rockets Games. It's great to go downtown Houston, stay in a hotel there, walk to restaurants before (or after or both) and then to the stadium. For the Spurs, you have to go to a restaurant off site (the Pearl is my choice) and then drive to the arena (which often includes traffic). Very different experiences, and I like the experience in Houston better.

The Spurs do a better job than the Rockets do in regard to their in-game entertainment.

Will Mayor Jones be the one to lose the Spurs? Everyone knows Austin will take them in a heartbeat.


The Spurs aren't going to Austin
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valtosca
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In reply to Obi Wan Ginobili • 3:44p, 8/19/25
AG
I hope you're right! The odds are low... for now...
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Burdizzo
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2:57p, 8/20/25
AG
I guess the only way to describe this is awkward.

Mayor Jones quizzed by Spurs Jesus after unexpectedly taking over Project Marvel rally https://www.ksat.com/video/news/2025/08/20/mayor-jones-quizzed-by-spurs-jesus-after-unexpectedly-taking-over-project-marvel-rally/
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valtosca
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4:12p, 8/20/25
AG
To hijack a rally... That's some arrogance!
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Burdizzo
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In reply to valtosca • 7:34p, 8/20/25
AG
valtosca said:
To hijack a rally... That's some arrogance!


I haven't watched it, but there is video of she and Marc Whyte butting heads at a D10 meeting. She might have worse political skills than Nirenberg.
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2008and1
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8:16p, 8/20/25
AG
Honestly my biggest issue with Project Marvel is that they are just throwing lipstick on a pig with the Alamodome. The dome is a terrible sporting venue and throwing a new facade on it isn't going to change that.
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lp01
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In reply to Burdizzo • 8:14a, 8/21/25
AG
I watched it and it went about as well as could be expected. Marc mentions that she was there to address the crowd about the budget, but she used it to go on about Project Marvel. He calls her out on it and the predictable happens.
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Burdizzo
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In reply to 2008and1 • 10:02a, 8/21/25
AG
2008and1 said:
Honestly my biggest issue with Project Marvel is that they are just throwing lipstick on a pig with the Alamodome. The dome is a terrible sporting venue and throwing a new facade on it isn't going to change that.



Yep, that building is going to sit there and remind everyone how this city has a long history of mismanaging itself. There are a lot of people in this town with generations of history. They don't forget, especially when they drive by a reminder everyday.

I have picked on the Spurs in this thread, but I do think they are worthy of a new venue. However, the waste, grift, and political shadiness do not go unnoticed when these topics come up.
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valtosca
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3:31p, 8/21/25
AG
Well, she did not get her "strategic pause"... Council voted her down 4-7. I bet she's not done trying... narcissist do not quit.
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cav14
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In reply to 2008and1 • 3:32p, 8/21/25
2008and1 said:
Honestly my biggest issue with Project Marvel is that they are just throwing lipstick on a pig with the Alamodome. The dome is a terrible sporting venue and throwing a new facade on it isn't going to change that.

But it's still the cheapest way to get it to make it good enough to attract major sports and non-sporting events to continue to go there. You think there is a significant drop in attendance when A&M has played in the Alamobowl just because of how "bad" the Alamodome is compared to other domes? No of course not, Aggies and all other team fans still go and support their team no matter where they play. The people that city developers really sell to are the big event executives and admin people who make the final decisions on where to host their big events.... not fans like you. So as long as the Alamodome is good enough to convince these big events to come to San Antonio which it has done so far, then nothing else matters. And spending billions of dollars on a brand new stadium as opposed to millions of dollars in renovations is the cheapest and most economical way for city developers to achieve this goal.

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cav14
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In reply to Burdizzo • 3:58p, 8/21/25
Burdizzo said:
2008and1 said:
Honestly my biggest issue with Project Marvel is that they are just throwing lipstick on a pig with the Alamodome. The dome is a terrible sporting venue and throwing a new facade on it isn't going to change that.



Yep, that building is going to sit there and remind everyone how this city has a long history of mismanaging itself. There are a lot of people in this town with generations of history. They don't forget, especially when they drive by a reminder everyday.

Please explain how the Alamodome has been mismanaged when they already paid itself off within a few years and even started to turn a profit a couple years ago? The only failure concerning the Alamodome is not securing an NFL team for the city of San Antonio. But without an NFL team, the Alamodome has been and is continued to be heavily utilized for many other sports and large events which include UTSA football, the Alamobowl, All-American Bowl, XFL/UFL football, NCAA March Madness, Texas UIL basketball and football, Texas UIL marching band, Bands of America, Drum Corps International, WWE, and big music tours (George Strait, Metallica, Prince, Paul McCartney, Rolling Stones, etc.).

True mismanagement would be what has happened with the big stadiums that were only built to attract the Olympics but then were hardly utilized for anything else after the Olympics. That would be like if the Alamodome did in fact attract an NFL team for San Antonio but then was never utilized for the other ~42ish weeks of the year.
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Burdizzo
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In reply to cav14 • 4:37p, 8/21/25
AG
With the exception of the Alamo Bowl, almost all of those events use about half of the capacity of the stands

I attended DCI with my daughter a few weeks ago. For some reason Lot C was closed when we arrived at about 4:00 PM in spite of there being numerous open spaces seen from the street. Not to worry, we parked across the highway for almost free. I sent an email to the city fire marshall along with pictures of vendors being allowed to block fire exits during the event.

For all the "utilization" that goes on, you would think COSA would build a parking garage and make more money. For Billy Joel we could not park in Lot C and paid a private lot $40.


I sure did enjoy getting teased by the Raiders and Saints, though.

Just think. We could have hosted the GOP convention there too of our mayor hadn't had his nose in the air.
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Macarthur
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In reply to Burdizzo • 11:25a, 8/22/25
Burdizzo said:
valtosca said:
To hijack a rally... That's some arrogance!


I haven't watched it, but there is video of she and Marc Whyte butting heads at a D10 meeting. She might have worse political skills than Nirenberg.


Yeah, she's really miscalculating this thing, big time.

There are some legitimate questions but she's being unnecessarily combative and confrontational. And Peter Holt isn't really someone you should try bully and publicly embarrass.
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Burdizzo
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1:18p, 8/22/25
AG
What is interesting to me is who is lining up for/against this. I kind of expected Spears and Whyte to tap the brakes, but they are full steam ahead. Meanwhile, the progressive mayor is the one asking for more time. Although, I think her true motive is to try and get some other objectives bundled with it. Another odd thing was Marc Whyte was on KTSA morning show this week. Trey Ware was his typical half-informed, conspiracy theoried, self. He started asking questions, and Whyte got REALLY defensive and sounded like he was about to cry. D10 really needs someone better. I don't have a lot of heartache over him supporting Marvel, but his tact really sucks. Seen it at some other public meetings.
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cav14
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In reply to Burdizzo • 4:53p, 8/22/25
Burdizzo said:
With the exception of the Alamo Bowl, almost all of those events use about half of the capacity of the stands

I attended DCI with my daughter a few weeks ago. For some reason Lot C was closed when we arrived at about 4:00 PM in spite of there being numerous open spaces seen from the street. Not to worry, we parked across the highway for almost free. I sent an email to the city fire marshall along with pictures of vendors being allowed to block fire exits during the event.

For all the "utilization" that goes on, you would think COSA would build a parking garage and make more money. For Billy Joel we could not park in Lot C and paid a private lot $40.


I sure did enjoy getting teased by the Raiders and Saints, though.

Just think. We could have hosted the GOP convention there too of our mayor hadn't had his nose in the air.

Yes, I know certain events don't use the Alamodome to its full capacity especially DCI, BOA, and Texas UIL State Marching band only using the home side of the stands. Same goes for many big concerts that block off one of the end zone stands because of the stage. But the Alamodome is being utilized at the very least so you can conveniently see your daughter compete in the DCI Southwestern Championships as opposed to driving to Houston or Dallas. And it attracts all of those non-football people to come to San Antonio in the first place to spend their money at all the local San Antonio establishments.

Professional American football does not occur all year round especially ones that can completely sell out the stadium. So like I already said, even if San Antonio succeeded in getting an NFL team, it would still be a huge boondoggle if they didn't at least make use of the Alamodome during the NFL off-season. I would also argue (along with many others) that a lot of current NFL stadiums are mismanaged since they still operate at a loss and/or haven't paid back their debts with their one NFL team trying to generate revenue for the city. They need to diversify their portfolio to better manage the large real estate and venue they have. So the fact that San Antonio has been able to make a profit from the Alamodome without the help of the NFL speaks to the success they have had in managing the use of the Alamodome even with how bad and undesirable we all agree that the dome itself is currently in.

As far as parking, that has never been an issue on the logistics on getting people to and from the Alamodome. The current large surface lots have served other purposes which include a carnival during Fiesta every year and COVID testing and vaccine center during 2020/2021. So I don't know if the city wants to subsidize your parking with a city-owned parking garage, but that could be on the table during Project Marvel negotiations. I have personally been hoping to see it used for Autocross or Cars and Coffee SA especially after being in hiatus after Six Flag Fiesta, but that's just me being selfish.
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Burdizzo
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In reply to cav14 • 7:56p, 8/22/25
AG
The point in all of this is that when the Alamo Dome was being pushed at the polls in the 1990s it was sold as an enticement for professional football team. You know, like the Spurs, but without a full time tenant. It's like a car salesman trying to convince me I need to buy a van because someday I might have 8 children. Reality is that after thirty years I realize I only needed a car for the two kids I had, and I use the van to haul stuff from Home Depot once a year.

We gits sold a bill of goods with the AlamoDome just like all the folks that believed the Spurs arena on the east side would be an economic engine.


Believe it or not I am not against a new arena for the Spurs downtown. I just hate the fake reasons people are giving for it.
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p_bubel
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3:27p, 8/25/25
As someone that deals with Alamo Dome traffic regularly, it gets used A LOT. More than you probably think.

It's more than paid for itself over the years. So will Marvel. Eventually. Well, the stuff that actually gets built.

(Don't count on the land bridge)

This clown of a mayor acting like she cares about fiscal policy is laughable. The rosy projection is standard operating procedure. (Remember that eye rolling impact study Baylor did when we left the conference?)

It's just not her rosy projection.

I have no strong opinions on the new arena really, but it would be nice to be able to walk to concerts.
If I went to any.

It's not really about revitalization either, the neighborhoods are doing well as it is. Added foot traffic downtown along with a reason stay in a hotel is a bigger factor, IMHO. Occupancy rates are off.
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aggieSO
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In reply to p_bubel • 11:10a, 8/26/25
Can't wait for the missions to be downtown as well
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Leggo My Elko
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In reply to aggieSO • 12:45p, 8/27/25
AG
aggieSO said:
Can't wait for the missions to be downtown as well

EDIT: I thought the missions moving downtown was part of Project Marvel, but upon research I guess it's separate?
This could be the biggest benefit of the whole thing and really the only thing that excites me about it. Does the Frost Centers location suck? yeah, but it's still usable and modern basketball arena's really aren't that different from one another. Will a new one downtown be cooler? Sure - but to me is it really that different? no.

But the Missions locations I feel keeps it from being even something residents (including myself) consider as a regular viable entertainment option. Been to a few missions games and the location and ballpark are so unremarkable it's unbelievable.

"Hey Honey, wanna fight traffic and go the a crappy ballpark located in a random part of the city surrounded by neighborhoods and warehouses to see a miner league game?

Versus

"Hey Honey, wanna go downtown tonight, we could go to the ballpark, catch part of the game then go eat and explore around the riverwalk?

Minor league baseball games with nice ballparks in good locations with stuff around them are a blast.

I've had the chance to go to several of the Quad Cities River Bandits in Iowa and it's a blast. It's top tier as minor league baseball experiences go.



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rwtxag83
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In reply to Burdizzo • 9:07a, 8/28/25
AG
Without an Alamodome, we had zero chance of ever attracting an NFL team. So far, all efforts to get one haven't worked, but it doesn't mean it will never happen. Instead, we've had the Alamobowl for 32 years, in addition to many regular season College games, and High School Regular season and playoff games, hindreds of concerts and numerous events. It was a good investment, and with the right kind of push, we could still get an NFL team.

Would I like to see these venues sold on the truth and facts rather than inflated figures and bluster? Sure, but that isn't gonna happen.

If you want to live in a city that has these kinds of events, you have to have taxpayer funded venues. It's a reality in every single city. We can leverage our city as a destination for more economic growth by attracting more company Headquarters if it's done right. D/FW has become a HUGE winner in the last few years. We need to challenge them, but we don't have the right leadership in the Mayor's office. We're the 7th largest city, but economically we're in the 30's to 40's. We're not doing enough to change this.

Project Marvel will push San Antonio to the best walkable downtown event area in the country. It may not be a game changer for attracting new conventions and events, but it will allow us to hold onto, and grow our current market share.

The best Bowl Game experience I've been to was by far the Sugar Bowl. Proximity and walkability from the French Quarter is the difference. San Antonio is a close 2nd, but these improvements will push us into an area no other city has.

Gina Jones is an idiot who's only trying to punch her political employment ticket. She's already pissed off a lot of people by how she's handled this. I hope she's exposed as the nimrod she is, and isn't re-elected. The Dems will get her some soft landing spot due to her loyalty, but I'd rather it be somewhere else. She lived he whole life as Gina Jones until it was time to run for office, and then it's Ortiz Jones, and the suckers came out of the woodwork to vote for her.

I don't think the Spurs are going anywhere, but keeping them from moving to Austin is not guaranteed.
Greater love hath no man than this....
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Burdizzo
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In reply to rwtxag83 • 12:38p, 8/28/25
AG
Quote:
Without an Alamodome, we had zero chance of ever attracting an NFL team.



Without an NFL stadium, Nashville got the Oilers. Houston built their new stadium AFTER getting the Texans

With 30 years of AlamoDome, and being teased by the Saints, Raiders, and Cowboys training camp, we have

San Antonio Nada


I don't think the lack of stadium is the anchor around San Antonio's neck when it comes to getting an NFL team. How much longer are we going to keep being gullible?
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