Russo Ukrainian peace on a knife's edge

70,126 Views | 1025 Replies | Last: 3 days ago by nortex97
pagerman @ work
How long do you want to ignore this user?
J. Walter Weatherman said:

samurai_science said:

J. Walter Weatherman said:

samurai_science said:

PlaneCrashGuy said:

nortex97 said:

I disagree. Nyt quote:
"The Baltic nations were the first members of the former Soviet Union to join NATO, bringing large stretches of Russia's border up against NATO's. The prospect of Ukraine, an even bigger former Soviet republic, following suit was so threatening to Moscow that it became one of the causes of the most devastating land war in generations.""


Devastating.

The "100% Putin" trope is officially out the window per NYT


Correct, but we need to keep war going for some reason


Who is "we"? Putin is the only person keeping the war going currently.


Warmonger's in the west want it to continue for some reason


Those "warmongers" have been aggressively pushing for a ceasefire for months, which Russia is blocking. Russia is the only reason this war is still continuing, not anyone in the West.
Additionally, if the Ukrainians want to fight to defend their country, who are we to tell them they can't?
“Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy. It's inherent virtue is the equal sharing of miseries." - Winston Churchill
Pumpkinhead
How long do you want to ignore this user?
A note to posters here, as a counter balance to the nortex97 poster's relentless forwarding of pro-Russia (primarily) views of this conflict, the below is a U.S. non-profit public military research institution that has been providing daily updates since this conflict began.

Ukraine Conflict Updates | Institute for the Study of War

Yesterday's summary (May 20):

Key Takeaways:
  • Senior Russian officials continue to deny the legitimacy of the Ukrainian president, government, and constitution and Ukraine's sovereignty despite Russian President Vladimir Putin's recent efforts to feign interest in peace negotiations to end the war.
  • Medvedev also reiterated long-standing Russian demands tantamount to Ukraine's complete capitulation.
  • Ukraine's Western allies continue to provide military aid to Ukraine and support Ukraine's defense industry.
  • The European Union (EU) and the United Kingdom (UK) announced several sanctions packages against Russia on May 20.
  • The Russian Ministry of Defense (MoD) confirmed Colonel General Valery Solodchuk's recent appointment as Central Military District (CMD) commander on May 20.
  • Russian forces recently advanced in Sumy and Kharkiv oblasts, near Chasiv Yar and Toretsk, and in the Zaporizhia direction.

If one of Russia's many conditions for any peace negotiations is it won't negotiate at all with the Zelensky government because they don't recognize that government as legitimate, among many other conditions such as all the land they annexed plus Ukraine has to fully disarm etc. etc.....then everybody might as well unfortunately settle in for a long long long conflict yet to go. Russia whether with irrational confidence or not seems determined to eventually try to take the entire country and is showing no interest in making any concessions that allow Ukraine to remain a sovereign country.

Putin not wanting to 'make a deal' is slowly but surely backing the Trump administration into a corner, where if the options are reduced to either walking away and risk a 'Fall of Saigon' event that would seriously damage the NATO alliance, or having to 'own the war' too and settle in for a long game of economic attrition against Russia...early signs are that the Trump admin will probably be forced to go the latter route.

As shown by this $310 million valued new military contract made with Ukraine just a couple of weeks ago:

After minerals deal, Trump approves arms to Ukraine, plays down peace plan | Russia-Ukraine war News | Al Jazeera

The difference being that the Trump admin via the rare earth minerals deal will now be able to spin the military aid sent to Ukraine as something that Ukraine is paying for (is not 'free' stuff).

Regardless, again, probably best to settle in for a long long conflict. See ya'll again on this in 2026 when it is probably still going.
oh no
How long do you want to ignore this user?
to counter what I've been programmed to believe is Russian propaganda, I'm going to give you some of what I've been programmed to believe is the gospel's god's honest truth (aka western propaganda).
nortex97
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Pumpkinhead said:

A note to posters here, as a counter balance to the nortex97 poster's relentless forwarding of pro-Russia (primarily) views of this conflict, the below is a U.S. non-profit public military research institution that has been providing daily updates since this conflict began.

Ukraine Conflict Updates | Institute for the Study of War

The difference being that the Trump admin via the rare earth minerals deal will now be able to spin the military aid sent to Ukraine as something that Ukraine is paying for (is not 'free' stuff).

I guess I should reply. The ISW, LOL. I won't attack it per se but as always, follow the money, per grok:
Quote:

Its funding primarily comes from U.S. military contractors such as General Dynamics, Raytheon, CACI, and DynCorp, and it maintains close ties with the U.S. military and defense industry. Its board includes prominent U.S. figures like General David Petraeus and General Jack Keane, and its stated mission is to advance U.S. national security through non-partisan, open-source intelligence analysis.
I don't put much credence in their reporting/narratives, but I know many do, and they are certainly prolific from their DC office (I read less than around 5-10 percent of their 'updates') near foggy bottom/US Institute for Peace/USAID. Petraeus I still hold some animus for, but whatever/off topic.

As to the 'rare earths' mineral deal for 'deals' consummated post-war, for 'rare earth' minerals Ukraine doesn't even have, I am dubious as I have stated, despite the lengthy claims about it's 'value'. Most of the actual valuable minerals in Ukraine are now (and will be) controlled by Russia. In short, we'll never get any actual 'pay back' from whatever is left of the Kiev regime for gear/money we ship to them, and it's a horrid investment in death, inflation (including food costs), energy spikes in Europe, corruption, you name it (the whole reason the Bidens loved focusing on them).

I'm not really in disagreement the war will likely drone on, if only because Kiev can't afford to accept Russia's terms, yet. I'm skeptical it will go on another year, however. We will just have to see if it is Brussels that winds up isolated or not. Still, the developments (or "RMA" if one prefers) of this war are nothing to be celebrated, imho, among our so-called 'friends' and enemies alike.
Pumpkinhead
How long do you want to ignore this user?
It doesn't matter if Ukraine actually ever 'pays back' the arms shipped to them by the Trump admin.

The only thing that matters is having some political cover to send the arms shipments.

This is a game as old as time.
nortex97
How long do you want to ignore this user?
As Rubio testifies again yesterday/today about trying to reign in the various foreign policy arms of our gov't outside the State Dept and executives' control, former Ambassador Brink continues to decry she isn't taking orders from the Peepaw White House any longer.

It's really something, how out of control our foreign policy components had gotten by Jan 2025.

These are the intellectual offspring of the Victoria Nuland/Eric Ciaramella/USAID/NED/ISW/Marie Yovanovich of the world who thought they could direct wars/revolutions for 'America's benefit' regardless of who was elected president, and are furious peace might happen now, despite their disapprobation.


Pumpkinhead
How long do you want to ignore this user?
oh no said:

to counter what I've been programmed to believe is Russian propaganda, I'm going to give you some of what I've been programmed to believe is the gospel's god's honest truth (aka western propaganda).
Since nortex97 has been contributing 0% of the Western Propaganda, only providing the Russian Propaganda, then yeah...was happy to help provide a balanced propaganda menu on here.
benchmark
How long do you want to ignore this user?
nortex97 said:

"The policy," she tells me, "has been to put pressure on Ukraine as the victim, rather than on Russia as the aggressor. And peace at any cost is not peace at all -- it's appeasement."

Hard to disagree.
nortex97
How long do you want to ignore this user?
benchmark said:

nortex97 said:

"The policy," she tells me, "has been to put pressure on Ukraine as the victim, rather than on Russia as the aggressor. And peace at any cost is not peace at all -- it's appeasement."

Hard to disagree.
Philosophically, sure, sounds good as a one-liner, from someone who until a couple weeks ago was serving at the pleasure of President Trump to support his policies. Rationally, it depends on the positions of the parties at a given point in time. Conceding to the Russian terms seems practical, but maybe z is really Gen Anthony McAuliffe.

Ultimately, peace must logically come at a cost as to the mutually exclusive objectives of the parties, or one party must be completely defeated.

I think ultimately her attitude as to the fealty owed to Kiev by the Executive branch betrays yet again the far deeper rot within our various foreign policy appendages. Given everything we've learned from USAID/testimony of folks I listed above, I think this my skepticism is well founded.
nortex97
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Putin visited the Kursk region, had some jokes.
Quote:

The Kremlin released a video early Wednesday of Putin meeting with local volunteers, including members of the Russian Orthodox Church and the Kremlin-aligned All-Russia People's Front, but did not specify when the visit took place.

During the visit, the Russian president accused Ukrainian forces of destroying Soviet World War II memorials in the region, calling them "people with neo-Nazi views."

"Even in an idiot contest, they'd only manage to win second place. Why? Because they're idiots," Putin said of Ukrainian soldiers. "By doing what they do, they show who they really are."
Maybe the hit in Spain was part of election preparations as claimed:

Rubio refuses to performatively declare Putin Satan/war criminal for the leftists/war hawks on the hill because he, gasp, thinks we should be talking to Russia, as we need them to agree to end the war/they are a significant nuclear power. At this point Rubio is my favorite part of the Administration, I have to admit.

Sitrep: Lavrov points out the fallacy of 'truce first,' as does the Belgian official;

Quote:

Quote:

"The moment there is a ceasefire the coalition of the willing can operate on Ukrainian soil" Belgian Defense Minister Theo Francken says France, Uk, Belgium and others will move in troops into Ukraine instantly when the fighting stops. Russia cannot agree to a ceasefire because of that.
Well, there you have itwhat I've been talking about for months now is spelled out with exceeding clarity: as soon as the 'ceasefire' trap is laid on Russia, Europe intends to flood Ukraine with troops in order to freeze the conflict until such time that Ukraine can be pumped up to the gills with new arms and is able to restart its aggression against Russia.
Pokrovsk-Toretsk axis seems to be developing rapidly. More at the link, of course. Forever war!
Phatbob
How long do you want to ignore this user?
If you are so against a forever war, why do you keep supporting the one country who keeps starting them and is literally the only one who could unilaterally end it in 3 minutes, yet chooses not to?
nortex97
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Phatbob said:

If you are so against a forever war, why do you keep supporting the one country who keeps starting them and is literally the only one who could unilaterally end it in 3 minutes, yet chooses not to?
I think we just disagree as to the origins of the conflict. It was Joe Biden himself, in a brief moment of lucidity, who glibly said Putin 'had to do something' (likely recalling a briefing he'd attended/received, as to the provocation plans having succeeded) before this phase of the war escalated. Almost all of our media ignores that and the longer history.

Now, it is true that Putin could order a full withdrawal, but that would also lead to his immediate toppling. The war is quite popular in Russia (more than it is here), which is why peace negotiations are so difficult, and driven by the events dating back at least to the Nuland Maidan coup.



In any case, our tax dollars and weapons aren't flowing to Russia, they are going to the Kiev regime.
FIDO_Ags
How long do you want to ignore this user?
That NBC article you linked doesn't say what you implied in your post.

And if you respond to this, try using some original thought and language instead of a spammed up reply with a bunch of tweets from people nobody on this board has ever heard of.
nortex97
How long do you want to ignore this user?
FIDO_Ags
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Yep, no original thoughts.
Phatbob
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Ahh, so Russia, the aggressor in the last... eleventy of it's last eleventy wars, has no choice but to continue to... agress, but it is everyone else who is the problem and needs to give in to whatever Russia wants? It's one thing to say there is no good guy in the conflict, but quite another to choose the side of the worst. I am finding your position absurd.
J. Walter Weatherman
How long do you want to ignore this user?
FIDO_Ags said:

That NBC article you linked doesn't say what you implied in your post.

And if you respond to this, try using some original thought and language instead of a spammed up reply with a bunch of tweets from people nobody on this board has ever heard of.


This is just known as a "nortex" at this point. He's just banking that people won't actually do any additional research or read the articles he posts.
benchmark
How long do you want to ignore this user?
nortex97 said:

I think ultimately her attitude as to the fealty owed to Kiev by the Executive branch betrays yet again the far deeper rot within our various foreign policy appendages. Given everything we've learned from USAID/testimony of folks I listed above, I think this my skepticism is well founded.
Good grief. Hyperbole much? Rubio/Trump should've replaced her day-1. They knew and shame on them if they didn't. She probably gave them 60 days notice and no one applied. It's now 6 weeks since her 'official' resignation and the best they've come up with is moving Cyprus' ambassador to Kiev to serve as Charg d'Affaires. Given our current policy, I doubt many (any) people will volunteer for that gig.
nortex97
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Trump is prioritizing American interests, as I had hoped, over those of Kiev or the war complex.


(That's Ukrainian Pravda, fwiw).
Again, I don't have a NYT subscription. Archive.is snip:
Quote:

Frustrated with the slow progress and Mr. Putin's intransigence, Mr. Trump has publicly mused about walking away from the negotiations. And he made clear in his post on Monday that he was eager to pull the United States out of the discussions and move on to doing business deals with Russia.

The conditions to end the war, Mr. Trump wrote, "will be negotiated between the two parties, as it can only be, because they know details of a negotiation that nobody else would be aware of."

Then he pivoted to what some European leaders believe is his real goal: a normalization of relations between Washington and Moscow.

"Russia wants to do largescale TRADE with the United States when this catastrophic 'bloodbath' is over, and I agree," Mr. Trump added. "There is a tremendous opportunity for Russia to create massive amounts of jobs and wealth. Its potential is UNLIMITED."
Quote:

But Mr. Trump has been eager to help U.S. companies benefit from Russia's energy sector and rare earth minerals, among other potential areas of investment. So far, Mr. Trump and his national security team have insisted none of those deals can happen before a peace deal between Russia and Ukraine.

Mr. Putin seems to understand Mr. Trump's eagerness for commerce, and has steered much of their conversations toward the potential economic relationship, according to people briefed on their phone calls on Monday and earlier this year. As a result, Europe is now moving toward new sanctions and the United States appears poised to move in the opposite direction, looking to get past Ukraine and nurture a larger relationship with Russia.
Good.
PlaneCrashGuy
How long do you want to ignore this user?
As far as I can tell, Russia has reduced the Ukrainian side to complaining about other posters.

I think every major media outlet has done an ample job of spreading "western propaganda" for years without ceasing. But I appreciate other posters feeling the need to balance it out. I wish there was something better to bring up than one side whining about Nortex.
docb
How long do you want to ignore this user?
The front lines tell the story. If we believed all the stupidity of the Russian propaganda on this thread from the usual suspects then we'd think Russia had already conquered Europe. Most of it is just reposts from a bunch of misfits. Armchair Warlord, Lord Bebo, and several other internet weirdos.
GAC06
How long do you want to ignore this user?
A cunning move to spurn the European Union for an expansionist kleptocracy with the GDP of Texas.

4D chess.
samurai_science
How long do you want to ignore this user?
docb said:

The front lines tell the story. If we believed all the stupidity of the Russian propaganda on this thread from the usual suspects then we'd think Russia had already conquered Europe. Most of it is just reposts from a bunch of misfits. Armchair Warlord, Lord Bebo, and several other internet weirdos.
The propaganda is the same from both sides, its all bs. Glad we are not funding it
PlaneCrashGuy
How long do you want to ignore this user?
docb said:

The front lines tell the story. If we believed all the stupidity of the Russian propaganda on this thread from the usual suspects then we'd think Russia had already conquered Europe. Most of it is just reposts from a bunch of misfits. Armchair Warlord, Lord Bebo, and several other internet weirdos.


I agree. You can tell who is winning based on which direction the front lines are moving. I said before, Ukraine getting kicked out of Kursk will prove to be costly when the negotiations finally start.
nortex97
How long do you want to ignore this user?

Accurate. Still ramping up, to 500/day:

19fortyfive: Ukraine faces a growing risk of military collapse.
Quote:

Where, then, does that leave the situation?

In a stalemate? No, the war is not in a stalemate, but the Russians continue winning on the ground. Last week the New York Times revealed that in the previous 16 months, the Russians had captured 1,826 square miles of Ukrainian territory. The article conceded that the Ukrainian casualties could have a catastrophic consequence, noting that in "wars of attrition, incremental gains can presage a breakthrough, if the losing side runs out of troops and ammunition and its defensive lines finally collapse."

This is on top of the October 2024 New York Times story that reported that Russia had been seizing Ukrainian territory every month since November 2022. In recent days, the commander of the elite 47th Mechanized Brigade in Ukraine had quit his post because "the stupid loss of people, trembling in front of a stupid generals, leads to nothing but failures." while the Ukrainian leadership fired the commander of the 59th Brigade.

If Zelensky and his European backers believe that the beleaguered Ukrainian Army can continue to fight, indefinitely, losing thousands of troops every month, and there will never be a break in the lines or a revolt from the troops they are playing, pardon the pun, Russian Roulette. No one can suffer those kinds of losses and fight like robots forever.

Consider also that the fact that after Biden's $61 billion aid package from May 2024 runs out, there is no more American aid coming. Europe clearly cannot make up the absence of American military aid on its own. Therefore, potentially within months, battlefield math will start to increasingly weigh against the Ukraine side, while Russia will only continue getting stronger and bigger militarily.
Again, accurate, more at the link. Many comments about Odessa:
nortex97
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Update; awesome news.

Not as great:


The Ukrainians and Russians alike should stick to military targets, imho.
MJ20/20
How long do you want to ignore this user?
There's definitely a lot of proganda on both sides, but that's the world we live in. Everything is proganda these days.

What I have a hard time with is if Russia is this paper tiger with inept leadership, dilapidated equipment, cold war technology, neglected and defunct nuclear arsenal, etc... why haven't they been shoved out of Ukraine? Why haven't the pro Ukraine powers grabbed this three legged, blind, and deaf red bear by the balls and thrown it over the fence?

Russian's actions are the equivalent of me walking uninvited into one of your houses grabbing a beer making a sandwich and sitting in your chair. When you and your buddies come in the room I say get the **** out I'm trying to watch TV and you all ***** and moan but go in the other room anyway.

It's why I don't really believe what we are being told. The story doesn't add up. The actions are not matching the words.
ABATTBQ11
How long do you want to ignore this user?
MJ20/20 said:

There's definitely a lot of proganda on both sides, but that's the world we live in. Everything is proganda these days.

What I have a hard time with is if Russia is this paper tiger with inept leadership, dilapidated equipment, cold war technology, neglected and defunct nuclear arsenal, etc... why haven't they been shoved out of Ukraine? Why haven't the pro Ukraine powers grabbed this three legged, blind, and deaf red bear by the balls and thrown it over the fence?

Russian's actions are the equivalent of me walking uninvited into one of your houses grabbing a beer making a sandwich and sitting in your chair. When you and your buddies come in the room I say get the **** out I'm trying to watch TV and you all ***** and moan but go in the other room anyway.

It's why I don't really believe what we are being told. The story doesn't add up. The actions are not matching the words.


Numbers and nukes.

Russia does have inept leadership. That is evidenced by their bungled initial invasion and getting bogged down and losing A LOT of equipment, including a bunch of EW and radar gear that was basically abandoned intact early on. They've also experienced multiple explosions and the near complete loss of weapons dumps due to poor storage and handling.

Much of their equipment is dilapidated and does suck. Their tanks are ****ing terrible, which has been evident since Desert Storm. However, not all of their equipment sucks. They're actually very good at EW and air defense against manned aircraft. They have adapted to tactics to hit strategic targets behind their lines.

Yes, they're kind of scraping the bottom of the barrel when it comes to equipment, but they're also likely producing just enough to get by. They can't move forward, but they aren't getting pushed out either.


What the Russians have going for them is numbers. They have a lot of bodies, and the tried and true strategy of the red army for many decades has been to simply overwhelm their opponent. They can do that to Ukraine because they're just so much bigger. After we outproduced the Germans into submission during WWII and watched the Russians push them back with shear numbers, we realized we couldn't defeat the red army the same way because Russia was proportionally the same size to us as we were to Germany. During the Cold War, we strove to fill that gap with enhanced capabilities, maximizing our potential kill ratio in any hypothetical conflict. Ukraine does not have that luxury because we're not giving them the best of what we have. They're basically getting what we went into Desert Storm and the Iraq War with, and it's on par with what Russia is fielding. So Ukraine can hold their own, but they can't exactly push Russia out, either.

The Russian nuclear arsenal is a black box. People assume there's been no maintenance or upkeep because that's the state of many of Russia's arsenals and the history of Russian military corruption, but nukes are a strategic asset and probably watched a lot more closely. They might be complete ****, but they also might not. No one really wants to try to answer that question, least of all the Europeans. That's why no one is pushing too hard. Personally, I think Russia probably takes decent care of its nuclear weapons stockpile, but they wouldn't use them because of MAD.

The analogy would be more accurate if you had a gun, but we pulled ours and blocked the TV. Russia isn't being pushed back, but they're also still burning a lot of money, resources, and manpower to stay where they are. They don't have what they want yet, so it's still kind of a standoff.
jrdaustin
How long do you want to ignore this user?
MouthBQ98 said:

Walk away = let Putin win. What's the pressure on Russia with that threat? What do they stand to lose by the US declining further involvement?

It's just a very very strange threat for a supposed mediator to make if you are trying to encourage an end and incentivize participation.

It does achieve making the USA look relatively impotent and inconsequential and that surely doesn't help us in our own negotiations.

I'd be okay with it if - as we walk away - we issue secondary sanctions on any entity that does business with Russia.

If Putin wants to bloviate and refuses to end this, we should walk away. But cripple him with secondary sanctions as we do so.

It's either that, or tell him that any more refusal on his part to end this will actively drag us into the conflict. I don't see Trump taking that tack. He has the will, but not the support to do so.

I also don't see Trump walking away and letting Russia have it's way with Ukraine. He would rightly be held responsible for the fall of Ukraine.
Pumpkinhead
How long do you want to ignore this user?
I have occasionally tuned into that Judging Freedom show the past few years, as well as other similar shows, and the guests on that show have often said 'Ukraine is close to collapsing' since 2023. I have heard them start talking about this key town Pokrovsk close to being taken by the Russians as early as 12 months ago. And still Russia has yet to accomplish that.

They also say stuff on that show like 'Russia kill ratio is 10:1' to lay the foundation for why Ukraine is about to fold, but never explain how sitting in their home offices in the USA where they get such information on casualties and how they know the information is reliable. But they speak as though they have 'facts'. Neither Russia or Ukraine are posting casualty scorecards.

I think those Judging Freedom guys have their own agendas and make a bunch of stuff to fit their narrative. Just more takes from the anti-West propaganda side.



samurai_science
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Pumpkinhead said:



have their own agendas and make a bunch of stuff to fit their narrative.



Thats both sides
Street Fighter
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Scott Ritter???? is a nut case.
Pumpkinhead
How long do you want to ignore this user?
samurai_science said:

Pumpkinhead said:



have their own agendas and make a bunch of stuff to fit their narrative.



Thats both sides


Yes. I think the only definite truth you can trust in this current conflict is:

1) It is now 3 years old.
2) Has had back and forth stages but Russia has seemed to be very slowly gaining some ground for quite awhile now.
3) There have been tremendous casualties on both sides. It has been awful and lots of Russians and Ukrainians have paid the ultimate price.
PlaneCrashGuy
How long do you want to ignore this user?
MJ20/20 said:

There's definitely a lot of proganda on both sides, but that's the world we live in. Everything is proganda these days.

What I have a hard time with is if Russia is this paper tiger with inept leadership, dilapidated equipment, cold war technology, neglected and defunct nuclear arsenal, etc... why haven't they been shoved out of Ukraine? Why haven't the pro Ukraine powers grabbed this three legged, blind, and deaf red bear by the balls and thrown it over the fence?

Russian's actions are the equivalent of me walking uninvited into one of your houses grabbing a beer making a sandwich and sitting in your chair. When you and your buddies come in the room I say get the **** out I'm trying to watch TV and you all ***** and moan but go in the other room anyway.

It's why I don't really believe what we are being told. The story doesn't add up. The actions are not matching the words.


Ukraine was pushing Russia back after the initial invasion, and also during their counteroffensive. Ukraine is no longer pushing Russia back.

Russia adapted (got better at fighting aka "stronger") and is now slowly inching forward, instead of being pushed back.
MJ20/20
How long do you want to ignore this user?
First off, thank you for the thought out and detailed response. I agree with your bottom line that Russia's nuclear capabilities / fitness and wilingness to use whatever it is they have operational is the real wild card in this conflict. There are so many scenarios surrounding this enigma that could be a disaster for Ukraine, Russia, and the world as a whole.

I have a lot ot add on this, but TexAgs isn't the place. I have reason to believe that both Ukraine (troop volume and quality not just Ukrainians) and Russia (putting a lot of their shoddy components together to create a machine greater than the sum of their parts) are both better than we are told across all media. The question is who's delta is greater.

On the analogy, noone knows what Putin wants save for a handful of people. I mean what he really wants, not what he allows to squirt out in any form of media. He is a very savy manipulator that may never show his cards. He may want to watch TV, burn the house down, or just show that he can walk in the room, but noone has put the fear of god in that man yet.
 
×
subscribe Verify your student status
See Subscription Benefits
Trial only available to users who have never subscribed or participated in a previous trial.